SE Intake and Exhaust Upgrade.

[Badbuzzard]

Hi all. I have flicked through the numerous posts on this topic but so many have extra items like ECU and injector upgrades. Can I get opinions on just upgrading intake and exhaust on totally stock SE. 2.5" or 3" exhaust? Would it make a noticeable difference and has anyone started with these two options and know first hand the benefits. Will it upset the computer? Has anyone removed their muffler and replaced with 2.5" pipe as Dann has suggested. Would appreciate feed back emensely.
Regards Rick

[ManiacLachy]

There will probably be a few replies to this, many people have done these bolt on first and move on to the ECU afterwards.

Intake will definitely give a noticeable improvement, the stock one is quite restrictive. This will also make more induction noise, whether that's a good thing or a bad thing is up to you.

Exhaust will also make an improvement, it reduced the time for the turbo to spool. 2.5" or 3" will work, 3" is less restrictive obviously and considered better by many.

You should upgrade the rubber elbow at the throttle body, and the recirc valve (BOV). The stock elbow is known to expand like a balloon under boost and pop off. The stock BOV is a known boost leak. You won't see much/any performance gain from this (unless the boost leak is large), but it's a good preventative measure.

You could upgrade the intercooler, if you're doing back to back boosted pulls it will heat soak easily and reduce performance. An ebay intercooler is a cheap easy option.

You could add a manual boost controller to increase boost slightly. You would want a boost gauge to monitor this though. It's the cheapest way to improve power, but arguably not the best.

All of these mods will exacerbate the ECU problems. The ECU causes a lean hesitation under heavy throttle about 5k RPM, then adds fuel suddenly and you rocket to the 6500 RPM red line. I believe this to be the cause of bent rods commonly found in SEs. You could investigate the FM fuel signal modifier and zenier diode fix, or when you get completely fed up look at the chiptorque tune, or standalone ECU.

I did the Elbow and BOV, then the exhaust, then the intake, then the intercooler. The car was noticeably improved by both the exhaust and intake, but the hesitation was horrible and boost cut was encountered easily.

I got fed up and I went the ECU route after this, and then even added flex fuel for E85. It's a slippery slope!

[track_addict]

I did the intake, exhaust etc mods on my SE on the stock computer. Do yourself a favour and just do the ECU first. You’ll have a much larger and enjoyable power band.


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[KevGoat]

Welcome!!

The SE, despite naysayers, in my opinion is a good car stock. That said, it becomes a great car with a few mods. Hiw far you take the mods, or want to sometime in the future, is probably the first step you want to consider. A plan of what you want will save you $$$ and extra hassles.

That said, and as we say often here, it's a slippery path, and one can end up on a completely different path very easily.

So, you've probably read that the stock ecu doesn't play nice with much in the way of mods. If you don't intend to get a tune - either simple via Chiptorque or going further with an aftermarket ecu - then you are limited.

My choice (and this is personal and subjective per person) I'd go intake first and leave the exhaust alone for now. The exhaust does "ok" (has one bottleneck spot) as it is. The intake was my first mod and made a very big difference. I used a BEGi intake, there's also FM and locally NitroDann could supply one. The BEGi has an enclosed air box that keeps it "legal" but I've also seen Nitro build really nice enclosures too and may possibly be cheaper than BEGi - I'd check with him first before going with the others at least.

The intake (oh and don't forget the throttle body inlet tube and the BOV will need upgrading FIRST if those haven't been upgraded yet!) won't upset the ecu, but you will notice the improvement.

Another upgrade to this without upsetting the ecu would be a larger intercooler.

Once I went past there, the ecu started showing subtle signs of not coping. I added an mbc and turned up the boost slightly and started noticing subtle hesitations in acceleration, especially when cold. I added at some stage some 321cc injectors which was a mistake as nothing was tuned for even that subtle change. Adding a downpipe (rest of my exhaust is still stock) really upset the car and I soon went with a Chiptorque upgrade which is essentially as far as I've gone to date.

The SE is a great car. There's plenty of info on them here and on the OS sites like Miata.net .... enjoy.

EDIT: ... most of this akready covered by faster typers than me lol

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[ManiacLachy]

I did the intake, exhaust etc mods on my SE on the stock computer. Do yourself a favour and just do the ECU first. You’ll have a much larger and enjoyable power band.


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The only issue I have with the idea of doing the ECU first (either standalone or chiptorque) is the need to re-tune as you then modify the rest of the system. I do think the ECU is the worst part of the car though!

I think Kev and I said almost the same things. Except I'd recommend the exhaust over the intake, simply because an exhaust sounds cool (but I'd agree the intake improves power more)

Badbuzzard, where are you located? There's probably a member near by who can show you their SE and what was good or bad.

[NitroDann]

100% agree so far.

The straight pipe rear muffler replacement is ok and isnt too obnoxious.

We can send every part you might ever want in the post, complete and ready to bolt up, but there is always a wait for a few weeks.

I would do exhaust intake intercooler BOV/pipe and electronics package in one go but it will cost 7kish. But you will make double the oem power and it will behave itself. It's a lot but you cannot do everything at once on a stock ecu, you need to leave the exhaust OR intake stock with a stock ecu.

All at once is pricey BUT the outright value is highest. In terms of the results per dollar it cannot be beaten. And I dont just mean power, I mean response, delivery, behaviour, reliability, and economy.

Dann

[Badbuzzard]

Thanks for taking the time out to respond to my conundrum all. I'm located in WA and we don't as far as I'm aware have such a dedicated performance shop for MX5's but a place called Hyperdrive are a stockist for Adaptronic ECU's and have worked on a few. I think I'll take the path of ECU, intake and inter cooler upgrade for a start and see how it goes. i'm aware there are plenty of options out there for the intake and inter cooler but I'd like to hear of any recommendations especially for ease of fitment and pieces supplied actually fitting.

[ManiacLachy]

Speak with NitroDann, as above. He's supplied all the go fast bits for my car, I've installed some with no fitment issues (intake, exhaust, elbow and bov), he did some bits while tuning my ECU.

A customer of Dann's in Perth just posted some excellent results on his NB8B (non-SE) turbo conversion, most turbo parts supplied by Dann. He used a Haltech, which would be my recommendation for you over the Adaptronic.
http://mx5cartalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=57&t=75323#p930351

[93_Clubman]

I'm located in WA

Welcome!
Being in WA, & perhaps in the Perth region, Steve Lee (0-4-1-9-5-2-0-9-8-8) is the MX5 go to man. A mobile mech these days, so probably won't be able to do all you need depending on how far you go, but I'm sure will be able to advise you who can if he can't.

[track_addict]

If I could make an ECU recommendation, don’t use an adaptronic select if you want it to run 99.9% like stock. I have one and it’s at is say 95%. The final 5% can’t be done with the ECU. I call it a “generation old.” I’m not sure how much better the new modular range is though.


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[Badbuzzard]

Thanks Track addict and others. Someone else told me today to stay clear of Adaptronic as his friend has one in his turbo Datsun and ain't to happy with the ongoing issues. There is a new model out but i don't know anyone running with it so????? I'm about to read the build from a guy here in WA and see what I can pick from it. I know Haltech has a good reputation so I'll look at this avenue also.

[greenMachine]

Welcome to the 'Club'

When I got mine last year, my first task was to make it legal (no cat, too loud), the second was to ditch the 17s for some 15x8 wheels.

After that, I put in a Nitrodann CAI, an Autronic SM4 ECU with EBC and WB, which with the 3in pipe gets me 140rwkw, a lovely smooth acceleration and a 7k redline. The 'bog' is but a bad memory!

I would second having a good look at a Haltech, I have used a PS1000 in my racecar for many years and was very happy with it - the new Elites seem to be a big step up.

However, it seems I have missed out on hearing about the BOV/TB elbow issue. Mine is still stock, but I have been looking closely at it this afternoon as I have a Skunk TB to install, and that will require a new bigger elbow.

Advice on sourcing this elbow, and making all the connections required, would be much appreciated.

[KevGoat]

greenMachine ... There's FM or BEGi elbows, but I'd contact Dann first...

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[Badbuzzard]

Must say thanks for the warm welcomes to the club. Great to see so many people interested in what others are doing or trying to achieve and sharing the wealth. Green Machine, your running a 3" from turbo back? Did you have this custom made or a ready made buy like all the 2.5" ones available on Ebay. I do like the idea of Dann's items for peace of mind ( knowing they'll fit). Dann, if your listening you gave me a quote for " Airbox" this isn't the intake is it or is it?

[KevGoat]

A bit off topic, but possibly also relevant to the OP ... a question for those with the Nitro 3" fitted ... What's the noise levels like compared to stock - roof up, roof down, even hard top fitted if relevant?

Most on here probably already know my mods - BEGi CAI, BEGi TBI, GFB BOV & MBC, FMIC, and BEGi downpipe to stock SE cat back, plus the Chiptorque upgraded tune. Since adding the downpipe, I have really liked the sound of the exhaust under all conditions - subtle, never intrusive at all, but more sporty and aggressive than stock with some nice crackles 'n pops on gear changes and deceleration. BUT!! - the last "power" piece I allowed for in the Chiptorque tune, is the exhaust! And, although I'm happy in pretty much every way with what I've got, I just can't help constantly feeling like I haven't finished the job properly and can't help wondering how much better it would all feel with an improved exhaust ... I'm sure you'll understand what I mean!! ...

So, with consideration that most of my usage these days is distance "holiday" touring, weekend cruising and normal metro driving, would a Nitro 3" exhaust upgrade drive me (and/or my wife!) nuts on a long day's drive, or would it be music to our ears and to my right foot ... ??

It's not a cheap upgrade (and in essence not really all that essential) so if I go ahead with it, I really need to get it right ... so, please be honest, hyper critical, and help me out guys ...

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