Koni sport vs Tokico Illuminas vs Revalved Bilsteins

[captaincabinets]

Hi all

Now that I have my exhaust and wheels sorted I'm researching suspension. Interested to hear what you would choose for a daily driver with some hills use. Looking for an improvement on stock suspension with a more comfortable ride than my oem NBs with 125k on them.

In the US the debate seems to be between the first two I mentioned. I've also found this guru from Fatcatmotorsports who swears by revalved Bilsteins. Anyone had any experience with this?

Thanks

[hks_kansei]

What springs are you using?

Of the three my choice would be the Koni, or the Bilsteins.

The Koni has the benefit of being adjustable, the Bilsteins the benefit of being valved to suit the springs you use (ie: when you get them re-valved talk to the workshop about this)


I'd just pick whichever is the cheaper option.

Note that the Konis (for NA anyway) will require you to drill out the top mounts to fit them. So you'll need to have access to a drill, and some good sharp bits to do so.

[captaincabinets]

Thanks Kansei. I'm fine with either stock or aftermarket springs, whichever better achieves my goals. What would you recommend?

[hks_kansei]

Really depends what you're wanting.
If you're happy with the cars current height, and find the springs are fine as far as stiffness goes, there's no real reason to change.

it's really only worth changing them if you want the car to be lower, stiffer, or both.

Most lowered springs are slightly stiffer than the standard ones, purely to help stop the car from hitting bump stops constantly, and also for a little better handling.
When I say slightly stiffer, it's usually not a massive difference, it's usually in the range of maybe 15-30% stiffer. Each brand differs a bit.


If you want the ride to remain similar to standard it's probably best to keep close to standard spring rates.
I had a set of Mazdaspeed B Spec springs on my NB, which lowered the car by 25mm or so, and were pretty close to OEM as far as comfort goes.

Kings springs lower the car by about the same amount and are a little bit stiffer, they're a really popular choice with Koni adjustable shocks.

[hks_kansei]

It's worth noting, I went from the Mazdaspeed springs on OEM shocks, to a set of Tein Flex Z coilovers.


The Teins certainly do mean the car is a lot more capable in corners, and allow a lot of adjustment, but at the downside of the stiffness meaning that it can be a bit skittish over bumps in the corner.

The Mazdaspeeds werent as stiff, and as such meant the car would lean a bit and sometimes unload the inside wheels. But it also meant that bumps wouldn't really bother the car as much.

[captaincabinets]

Yeah skittish sounds like it wouldn't meet my DD goals. I'm not desperate to lower it, she scrapes on some driveways already. Do the stock springs degrade over time?

[speed]

Yes, they can sag, meaning they lower the car over time.

How much should a revalve cost on the bilsteins? Maybe I should get mine redone.

[hks_kansei]

Yeah skittish sounds like it wouldn't meet my DD goals. I'm not desperate to lower it, she scrapes on some driveways already. Do the stock springs degrade over time?

Yes, but generally it's not a huge amount.

From memory my car was around 140mm from ground to pinch weld with my original springs, so if yours is somewhere around that area they've likely not sagged much, if at all.

Worth noting that I'm pretty sure Mazda specs had a pretty broad tolerance as far as ride height, I seem to recall the manufacturing specs allowing something like +-20mm from the normal measurement.


If you want new standard height springs I'm pretty sure Kings springs sell a standard height one, you'd have to ask them if the spring rate is the same as factory or stiffer.
They're around $300 to $400 for a set of 4 from memory.

[93_Clubman]

How much should a revalve cost on the bilsteins?

Receipt I have is for $600 for 4 Clubman Bilsteins back in 2007 from Quadrant Suspension, the Vic Bilstein specialist. In 2012 when they rebuilt another Bilstein (x1) for me to the same specs it was $169.

[speed]

Thanks for that, is good to know.

[pepejesus]

By the time you factor in the cost of springs, dampers and a revalve, you might as well just get an entry level coilover kit like the MCA Blues or BC Racing BRs.

They will be significantly stiffer than stock so might not meet your 'more comfortable ride' requirement, but this is very subjective. If they are too stiff you have the option of softening up the damping and/or changing to softer springs.

Both are a popular option so it shouldn't be too hard to find someone with them and get a test ride.

[speed]

Or just get you self some 2nd hand bilsteins with springs in good condition and save yourself $

[captaincabinets]

Thanks for the tips all. Am currently emailing back and forth with Quadrant already, alongside Bilstein and another place so I can gauge prices. From the feedback I've read on the m.net suspension thread, revalved Bilstein owners seem happier with the ride comfort and performance than any other group. Probably biased and finding what I'm looking for but that's how I saw it.

Will update this thread with my progress for the benefit of others.

[captaincabinets]

So far no price info back from any rebuilding party. Also had feedback that revalved Bilsteins from anywhere but FCM in the US tend to be track oriented rather than DD. So I'm trying to work out a way to get my hands on some Illuminas for a reasonable price.

Not 100% decided on springs. Might keep my stock ones for now and see how I like them before changing.

[hks_kansei]

The valving thing about places other than FCM is rubbish.

The whole point of a revalve is that they're replacing the parts with ones different to factory, if you want it more road oriented all you need to do is ask them to valve them to suit whatever you want.

Each shop will have their own default as such, but the whole point of the revalve is that you can do custom valving if preferred