Low km NC difficult getting in gear

[Dre]

Bit sad to be posting this but as you would know I got a '13 nc mx5 a few days ago. I took it for a spin on my lunch break today (1st day back at work) and it was hard to get into 2nd gear.

I did notice it has a tiny bit of a rattle/hiss at low revs but I assumed that was normal.. Now I'm a bit worried. It gets better as the car warms up. I always warm up before I take off but I mean a couple of minutes of driving when I say that.

I've left the dealer a msg. They've read but not replied.

With just over 8,000kms on the car I can probably rule out the plastic bushing that wears on these cars, is that about right?

The car is under warranty but I'm not sure what's covered etc. I bought the car from Vic, I'm in Sydney.

Hopefully they contact me tomorrow but just wondering if anyone has some insight to offer.

[bruce]

Low fluid?
Under warranty, don't sweat.

[JBT]

...I did notice it has a tiny bit of a rattle/hiss at low revs but I assumed that was normal...

Yep, unfortunately that's normal for a manual NC below about 1800 RPM under load once the transmission is hot. It's bad enough for some people to have thought it was detonation.
It's explained away as 'gear rollover' but I think of it as a sh1t gearbox - never heard such a noise in any car before.
They have been reported to be a bit pesky getting into 2nd when the tranny is cold. I never had that issue until I replaced the factory oil at 80,000km. Even then, it was only just a little bit pesky cold - like the first kilometre.
It seems to have sorted itself out again now at 92,000km and all changes are smooth.

[Regie]

Its just like a Ferrari gearbox. Mine and a lot of other NC owners have a pretty notchy 2nd gear until the box gets warm.

As for the noise, thats normal also

[Lokiel]

A friend of mine bought a new Toyota 86 a couple of years ago (see http://mx5cartalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=56098&p=706783&hilit=86#p706783) and from day 1 he complained about it being hard to get into 2nd gear when cold and that the car was downright dangerous at times because he couldn't get 2nd and had to go to 3rd when crossing a road from a standing start with traffic approaching him. He kept taking it back to Toyota who simply changed the type of gearbox oil used and while it got a little better, the problem lingered, he got fed up with the car and Toyota and sold it late last year, losing over $10,000 in the sale and swearing off Toyota for the rest of his life.

The 6-speed gearbox in the 86 is an Aisin gearbox which is used by many of the Japanese manufacturers (Mazda, Toyota, Nissan - might have been used in the Honda S2000 too) and was even used in the NBs (the Mazda NA/NB 5-speed gearboxes are MUCH nicer). This issue is not uncommon and it really amazes me that it still exists today - I would have thought that by now they would have licked all the issues with the gearbox OR chosen another better gearbox. Why are so many Japanese manufacturers sticking with it and if it's only a small portion that are problematic, why can't/won't they fix them? Toyota refused to replace my mate's gearbox in preference of exploring "other options" and I suggested he enact the "Lemon Law" since he'd taken the car back 5 times already with the same complaint but he just wanted to be rid of the car.

When I was looking at buying a DD, I decided on a Mazda 3 and preferred the BK series because it had the 5-speed gearbox rather than the 6-speed gearbox (and I hate the "smile" on the next generation's front).

You may be stuck with this problem unfortunately but try contacting Automotive Plus (ie. MX5 specialists) about this since they will have a few ideas about how to address it (also do some Google searches using "86" and "gearbox" as keywords to see some of their solutions).

[Mr Morlock]

The story of the 86 really is not relevant

You don't need to warm your car up that is no longer recommended.

The change from 1 to 2 when cold should be sympathetic ie don't slam through.

Read your warranty but the car will be covered for faults. It's covered Aust wide so bought interstate is not an issue.

Visit the dealer meet with the workshop rep and see what they have to say- they may test drive etc. Mazda will want a happy customer.

[Black_Penguin]

The story of the 86 is very relevant as its the same gearbox internals just a different bellhousing to suit the different motors.

[Mr Morlock]

The 86 is not an MX5 and does anyone on here really know if the gearboxs are identical-I suspect not. Besides since this is an MX5 forum we can readily draw on MX5 NC for comparison anyway. We do know earlier modes 5 speeds and 6 speeds are not the same as an NC despite being made by Aisin I would also be surprised that one would judge an 86 as steer clear of because of one person's experience. Also with regard to "uncommon" there is plenty of literature and feedback from experts that there are few if any manual gearboxes that are perfect and even fewer when the driver abuses them- clearly not applicable in this case.I don't expect a slick fast change 1- to 2 esp when cold- if it seriously baulks and refuses to engage then that is another thing. If someone feels that a gearbox is not changing the way it should then it needs to be verified by an expert or simply by others with similiar models.

[Lokiel]

The story of the 86 is very relevant as its the same gearbox internals just a different bellhousing to suit the different motors.

No point arguing, it's Mr Morlock.

[emily_mx5]

Try using some excellent synthetic fluid such as Redline.
It transformed my NB 6 speed from horrible to awesome

[Regie]

This is what i use

http://www.nulon.com.au/products/Gear_a ... Kupjcag2S0

works great and its the same specification as the Motocraft oil all the NC owners in the states rave about.

Its not cheap @ $30 per litre (box takes 2.2l but works well

[zero00]

Its just like a Ferrari gearbox. Mine and a lot of other NC owners have a pretty notchy 2nd gear until the box gets warm.

As for the noise, thats normal also

Agree Regie, my NB when cold is 'tight' to get into 2nd but fine after 1-2km, and relating to Lokiel's comment on his friend with the 86, mine is the same again for 1-2 km

In difference, the NA is easy from cold

Comments regarding the original post ARE relative regardless of the type of car, thought provoking also as many forum members have 'other makes' parked in their garages

[Mr Morlock]

I did raise what I thought was a valid point- has the NC really got the same gearbox as an 86? I am doubtful that it would but I fully concede that I don't know.

I also think nbse2 is making very general statements about "dealers" The view of dealers and their mechanics not knowing their cars is not supportable as a bigger picture. The dealers have the best access and opportunity of tech data on their brand. Only this week I consulted a well known repairer and the guy that came with me in my car for a diagnosis turned out to have just left Ford where he had worked as a mechanic for some years. He was able to pinpoint a problem within a few KMs and he knew the vehicle inside out because he worked on them for so many years. He said he was not nearly as up to speed on Holdens.

If a car is under warranty then it should be taken to the dealer if there is a problem- I would have thought this was self evident. If people own an upmarket import one will find that the generalists just don't and cannot be expected to be experts on cars they rarely see nor have training and test equipment etc. When its out of warranty then a specialist repairer for MX5s may well be a good choice.

As for Toyota reliability they may have slipped in recent years but they still consistently rank in the top echelon. As a philosophy and a practise they had the most envious approach to quality in the industry.

[Dre]

Thanks for the help guys. It's funny that I read and watched so many reviews and this wasn't mentioned.

I'm a bit relieved that it's common thing and not an abused gearbox.

I spoke to the dealership service dept and the guy told me "the boxes are a bit tight" and suggested taking it to a local dealer and letting them drive it if I suspect somethings wrong.

For now I'll just enjoy the car and watch my shifting.