High Oil Pressure

[Magpie]

if you do run the peterson regulator does this negate the need to use the factory releif valve on the oem pump? or do you still chock/shim it in conjunction with the external regulator?

The external regulator (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/370518800205?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649) replaces the factory relief valve on the OEM pump.

Yes you have to chock/shim the factory relief valve as the external regulator takes over its role.

Thanks for posting in this thread as it reminded me that I need to order an external regulator for my engine build.

[timk]

Do you know of this is still a problem on the larger VVT pumps and should I be concerned if I am spinning my engine to 7600rpm?

[NitroDann]

Can it not be fitted here? and plumbed back into a fitting in the side of the sump?

Does anybody have images of the internal setup?



Dann

[Magpie]

This may help from http://www.aviaid.com/pdfs/cat05.pdf

...Adjustable remote regulators relocate the pressure regulation function to a more convenient location. While a convenience for a dry sump, this can be a valuable addition to an internal wet sump pump. Remote regulators bypass oil through an external port when pressure building on the outlet side lifts a piston enough to open the bypass orifice. By changing the way oil is bypassed system dynamics change. A standard regulator bypasses oil from the outlet side of the pump back to the inlet side, reusing the bypassed oil. Engine oil demand is relatively fixed.

Assume a small block Chevy demands 6 gpm. If the pump puts out 10 gpm, and the engine takes 6 gpm, 4 gpm must be relieved. The pump is going to pump 10 gpm. The pan and pickup only need to deliver the 6 gpm required by the engine. The pickup must flow 6 gpm & the oil pan must deliver 6 gpm to the pickup.

With a remote regulator the entire system moves 10 gpm. The bypassed oil no longer makes up part of the demand of the pump. The pickup and the oil pan must both deliver 10 gpm to the pump. This is a 66% increase in flow. In a wet sump a restrictive pickup or a poor pan design will result in cavitation & starvation. Too much velocity in a system also means wasted power.

A 2nd issue is that any time oil crosses an orifice it aerates and heats. In a standard pump this heated and aerated oil is recirculated directly back into the oil inlet stream. A remote regulator bypasses the oil back to the pan or the dry sump tank. This allows bypassed oil to release entrapped air and to cool. The oil stream to the pump is cooler and 'cleaner', less entrapped air...

[NitroDann]

Either way then, the system will work the same.

So how are people doing it on a BP, internally or externally? Externally allows adjustment.

Dann

[project.r.racing]

Do you know of this is still a problem on the larger VVT pumps and should I be concerned if I am spinning my engine to 7600rpm?

They are larger? Time to hit google.

[rxmx]

if you do run the peterson regulator does this negate the need to use the factory releif valve on the oem pump? or do you still chock/shim it in conjunction with the external regulator?

The external regulator (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/370518800205?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1438.l2649) replaces the factory relief valve on the OEM pump.

Yes you have to chock/shim the factory relief valve as the external regulator takes over its role.

Thanks for posting in this thread as it reminded me that I need to order an external regulator for my engine build.

Ok cool, thanks for the link

Do you know of this is still a problem on the larger VVT pumps and should I be concerned if I am spinning my engine to 7600rpm?

They are larger? Time to hit google.

There's mention of a slightly thicker gear in the vvt oil pump in the following threads with part numbers, one is by the guy who sells the chromoly gears.

http://www.miataturbo.net/engine-performance-56/1-8-nb-oil-pumps-62506/
http://www.miataturbo.net/boundary-engineering-miata-accessories-62/shimmed-oil-pump-why-56016/

[project.r.racing]

Thanks for the links. So roughly 0.5mm thicker.

[timk]

Sorry for dragging up an old thread but I figure it's still relevant.

I wonder if the pressure relief bypass outlet is any bigger on the VVT pump? If not then the thicker gears are probably just compounding the problem!

Does anyone have any pictures of the Peterson unit fitted? I assume the 'relief out' port typically gets dumped into the sump much like a turbo oil return would?

[sailaholic]

Zoom zoom used both the nbb oil pump and then changed to the Paterson unit, so would know what the deal is.

Sent from my GT-I9100 using Tapatalk 2

[zoomzoom]

Hey mate,

The relief outlet on the std pump is about a 10mm drilled hole and the 8B pump is a much larger cast slot. I think I still have a later pump around somewhere but I'm not sure. I have the peterson relief fitted it is just fitted in the line to the cooler but I don't have any photos atm. You are correct the drain from the relief just goes back to the sump, I have another -10an fitting welded directly opposite the drain from the turbo for the relief.

Cheers,

Tim

[mx5gem]

bringing an old topic alive again.....

I am wanting to plumb a peterson oil relief valve into my cars oil system to keep oil pressure under control, as intending to use car for track work, and constant high revs do bad things to std pumps/relief valves.


To avoid needing to pull the motor to drill the sump (I'm not keen to drill it in situ using the grease/air pressure tricks) can you just plumb the return line from the peterson into the rocker cover and let it drain back into the sump that way. This seems a nice easy way to get the relief oil back into the motor, and taking the rocker cover off to drill and tap is 1000x easier than pulling the whole motor out and removing/refitting the sump.

Is this a bad idea? Will it cause any problems?

[zoomzoom]

I would think that it would be a bad idea to plumb back into the valve cover as this would require all bypassed oil to flow back to the sump via the cylinder head drains, this could well lead to having too much oil in the head and a low oil level in the sump. That being said, I do not know what kind of flow the pumps produce and how much of that flow is bypassed to keep the pressure under control however I wouldn't want to find out through trying that the cylinder head drains cannot cope.

It is possible to remove the sump with the engine in the car, I did so earlier this year to install a baffle but it definitely is not a fun job! I did it by removing the front cross member with the car up on stands. It is a bit of a task any way you approach it.

Cheers,

Tim

[Magpie]

Have a look at this done by gslender http://mx5cartalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=711906#p711906

To use the Peterson control you need to effectivley have the OEM relief valve held open. It maybe possible to do this without taking the oil pump off. If it was me I would be taking the oil pump off and fitting at least a upgraded oil pump gears as well as fitting the Peterson. Make sure you have an accurate oil pressure gauge fitted as you will need to adjust it (Peterson control) as required.

If I had my car I could have taken photos of how it is installed on my car.

[zoomzoom]

Have a look at this done by gslender http://mx5cartalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=711906#p711906

To use the Peterson control you need to effectivley have the OEM relief valve held open. It maybe possible to do this without taking the oil pump off. If it was me I would be taking the oil pump off and fitting at least a upgraded oil pump gears as well as fitting the Peterson. Make sure you have an accurate oil pressure gauge fitted as you will need to adjust it (Peterson control) as required.

If I had my car I could have taken photos of how it is installed on my car.

I think you mean closed, if it is held open you will have not oil pressure at idle or low rpm.

The peterson valve could still be used in conjunction with the OEM but it would only be controlling the pressure at high flow rates (high rpm) when the OEM relief valve cannot cope with the flow. Up to this point the oil pressure would be maintained by the OEM relief the same as normal unless the peterson valve is set to a lower pressure.

Cheers,

Tim