Prepping SE for Chiptorque flash

Discussion regarding Turbocharged and supercharged MX-5s

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tophus
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Re: Prepping SE for Chiptorque flash

Postby tophus » Wed Oct 15, 2014 4:24 pm

93_Clubman wrote:
tophus wrote:So in Victoria, even a chiptorque mod to the stock ECU would not be 'legal' compared to a complete ECU replacement?

Mid 2014 Vic EPA update:
viewtopic.php?f=81&t=33873&p=809833#p809833



'They must also be sealed or otherwise constructed so as not to be reprogrammable'

What is conflicting about this statement is that a stock SE ECU can be 'reprogrammed'...

Take a chiptorque setup for example, does anyone know how far off EPA guidelines the SE emissions would become? How hard would it be to have it tuned to emissions, and can you test it cheaper than taking it to the EPA every time?

I dont think I would go to this length, but this would be good knowledge for everyone to have...
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Magpie
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Re: Prepping SE for Chiptorque flash

Postby Magpie » Wed Oct 15, 2014 4:58 pm

What is conflicting about this statement is that a stock SE ECU can be 'reprogrammed'...

The law allows manufacturers to 'reprogramme' their ECU's. The manufacturers take the responsibilty of complying with the laws. The issue is the owner or somebody who is not authorised modifying ECU's.

Ask Chiptorque if they have been authorised by the manufacturer to modify the ECU. You will find that Chiptorque passes the risk of compliance onto the owner and they do not accept any responsibility for compliance.

This is an issue of environmental law where resellers of aftermarket modifications do not advise the buyer of the risks, rather they state something like "for off road use only" and hence transfer the risk to the buyer.

As stated previously by others there is a very low risk of getting caught, however it is your risk and you will have nobody else to blame or have recourse against unless you can prove something under consumer law. Using Consumer Law will be difficult as you will be dealing with companies that have ensured that they have no exposure/risk and have done everything correctley under Consumer Law.

By the way I'm not saying what Chiptorque does is illegal in anyway, but it pays to read the fine print http://www.chiptorque.com.au/download/chiptorque-job-card/

DURING ENGINE AND / OR VEHICLE TESTING, REPAIR AND / OR STORAGE
DEFINITIONS
a) Locasia Pty. Ltd. A.B.N. 44 060 809 903 trading as ChipTorque, its agents and its servants, is described hereafter as ChipTorque.
b) Owner includes the owner's nominated agent, customer or corporation.
c) Testing includes repair, tuning, fitting, development and the supply of parts and equipment.

ChipTorque accept that the owner warrants that any engine and / or vehicle accepted for testing is in a suitable condition for any loads, speeds or temperatures that would be imposed, or may arise, during such testing which includes testing using our chassis dynamometer etc. and that all parts used in the engine and the vehicle construction are suitable for any severe duty that will be imposed on the engine or vehicle during testing. Such testing normally imposes loads greatly exceeding manufacturer's specifications.

Subject to compliance with the Workplace Health & Safety Act, the owner or their nominated agent is requested to either view and control such testing, or supply written instructions detailing any conditions or restrictions they may wish it be imposed during such testing. If no instructions are given the owner / agent agrees expressly by implications default that ChipTorque will carry out any testing at their sole discretion.

ChipTorque will not be responsible for any damage, no matter how arising, which may occur during testing / repair or fitting of components to the engine, vehicle or electronics or any direct or consequential cost or costs as a result of such testing, repair or fitting.

In the case of Supplementary Restraint Systems, ChipTorque is not responsible for any associated costs for accidental deployment of the apparatus howsoever caused. Goods presented for repair may be replaced by refurbished goods of the same type rather than being repaired. Refurbished parts may be used to repair the goods. Goods containing user-generated or learned data may result in loss of data during the course of the repair.

ChipTorque does not carry any insurance covering any customer property, engines, vehicles or parts for any risks at all. ChipTorque therefore are under no duty or responsibility of any sort whatever and whenever in contract or in tort or otherwise for any loss including theft, burglary, damage, harm, or reduction in value which happens to the customer's property however that occurs.

ChipTorque reserve the right to withhold the customer’s property until payment in full for work carried out and parts supplied has been made. Where delayed collection of the vehicle or delayed delivery of customer supplied parts for job progression occurs, a vehicle storage fee of $25.00 per calendar day is charged. EFI diagnosis is chargeable at $200.00 for the first hour and at a minimum of $120.00 per hour thereafter. All other on site testing, including waiting time and travelling time, is chargeable at a minimum of $120.00 per hour. All custom programming and/or 2WD dyno work is chargeable at a minimum of $250.00 per hour. All custom programming and/or 4WD dyno work is chargeable at a minimum of $350.00 per hour. A cleaning fee of $200 may be charged if substantial fluids or debris from the vehicle contaminates the dyno or workshop area.

We accept goods for inspection, custody, storage, repair or other treatment subject to the provisions of “The Disposal of Uncollected Goods Act 1967 – 1973”. Conditions of this act allow for disposal of uncollected goods and vehicles under certain circumstances after not less than 6months.

Nothing in these terms and exclusions of liability and the accompanying terms and conditions of supply is intended to exclude, restrict
or modify rights which you may have under the Competition and Consumer Act 2010 (Cth) or any other legislation which may not be
excluded, restricted or modified by agreement, subject only that they are the sole basis on which ChipTorque are willing to take on
work or other responsibilities.

To the extent permitted by law, the owner / agent releases ChipTorque and its employees and agents from any and all liability. The
governing law of the contract between Locasia Pty Ltd and you, the customer, is the law of Queensland.

93_Clubman
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Re: Prepping SE for Chiptorque flash

Postby 93_Clubman » Wed Oct 15, 2014 5:25 pm

tophus wrote:What is conflicting about this statement is that a stock SE ECU can be 'reprogrammed'...
It can be rechipped, ie a replacement chip, but the original chip can't be reflashed or otherwise adjusted.

...can you test it cheaper than taking it to the EPA every time?
Unfortunately not - see last 3 posts page 1 here: viewtopic.php?f=52&t=58639&p=738975&hilit=victorian+compliance#p738975

tophus
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Re: Prepping SE for Chiptorque flash

Postby tophus » Wed Oct 15, 2014 5:34 pm

Very informative, thanks guys.

I hope this has contributed to your thread Roadrunner (Sorry if it has hijacked it a little)

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Roadrunner
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Re: Prepping SE for Chiptorque flash

Postby Roadrunner » Wed Oct 15, 2014 8:50 pm

That's all good, the more info the better.
But yes basically chiptorque say that any change from factory can effect emissions and street legality so it's the owners responsibility in keeping the car legal.
Ie it's the good old "for off road use only" line :)
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bruce
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Re: Prepping SE for Chiptorque flash

Postby bruce » Wed Oct 15, 2014 9:09 pm

In Vic, if you pass the Emissions Test, no matter what computer, you are legal.
I did it a month ago.

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timk
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Re: Prepping SE for Chiptorque flash

Postby timk » Wed Oct 15, 2014 11:30 pm

I had the ChipTorque flash done, and Lachlan was able to scale the map to suit my Denso RX-8 injectors. I posted about it here:
My visit to ChipTorque today

With a bigger turbo and more boost I ended up maxing out the airflow meter and looked at using a Eunos 800M one, but in the end decided to swap to an Adaptronic.

Cheers


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