quite pretty, innit? (ND launch)

[Vat]

Attracting entry level buyers who will buy a higher margin higher spec model next time. Increased volumes means lower cost per unit overall.

[davekmoore]

Attracting entry level buyers who will buy a higher margin higher spec model next time. Increased volumes means lower cost per unit overall.

Yes.
The suggested 13:1 comp might get wound up a bit.
Dunno how much lighter the 1.5L will be than the 2.0L, but 2.5L Mazda 3 SP25 weighs 42kgs more than 2.0L Maxx and has fogs, dual climate, auto wipers and lights, bigger wheels. So maybe 0.5L change in motor size makes 25kgs of a weight difference? Is 25kgs lighter enough to justify dropping in a 1.5L? Maybe, bearing in mind the initial target market.

[Nevyn72]

Most posts on the big forum suggest that the actual weight different between the 1.5 and 2.0 litre engines by themselves is only around ~4-5kg, with production costs being almost identical.

The most common reasons being suggested for the 1.5 being offered are;
- fuel economy
- tax considerations in certain markets (smaller engines with less power and lower emissions are taxed less on sale and during ownership)

[davekmoore]

Fogs, dual climate, auto wipers and lights and bigger wheels must be heavier than I guessed then. I was also taking into account that the existing different sizes of Skyactiv 2.0L and 2.5L motors are built on different production lines and share very few components, unlike, Once upon a Time, a Mini 848 or 998.

[speed]

I suspect they offer a buzz box so they can charge much more for the 2.0
A cheaper price opens up the market segment and in theory sells more cars.
Mazda wants more mx5's on the road. They expect people will say wow look another mx5.
They don't expect people to say, look another mx5 with a motor that's too small for a sports car of this day and age. Most people no nothing about cars and are happy with a pretty shape. Most mx5 owners probably fit into this category, sure not us forum types but I dare say that we are the minority.


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[Guran]

The redline on the tachometer of one the NDs displayed at California was 7600rpm. That's the start of redline. Rev cutout is likely to be a few hundred higher, maybe 8000rpm. It's going to be a revvy little thing!

[plohl]

Everyone always complains about power but a large percentage of people never utilise a car's full power anyway. Look at the 86, it wasn't powerful enough but they have still sold heaps of them.

to paraphrase someone...

If you can't go fast on 130hp, 900 won't help you"

[gslender]

Still seems like a risky option when you have really good alternatives available.

I can understand how when the NA6 was developed they had a 1.6 ready to use, it was proven and available. They didn't have a 1.8 or 2.0 and the project was already a gamble and they didn't know if it would even sell.

Mazda know that they were criticized for being under powered, and they responded by adding a 1.8, and 1.8 with go fast mods, and then a 1.8 turbo and then 2.0 - each time responding not to just the increased weight of the car, but also improving the power/weight ratio and overall 0-100 time. The NC screams compared to a NA6

The 1991 NA6 with a 1.6 I4 produced 85kW and a curb weight of 940kg - so 11.0kg/kW

The 2014 NC with 2.0 I4 produced 125kW and a curb weight of 1,153kg - so 9.2kg/kW

The 2015 ND with a 1.5 I4 is suggested at 96kW and a curb weight of 1020kg - so 10.6kg/kW

I guess if you expect to sell the remain NC stock, you need to announce that the ND will be not as quick, but it will look good, and that if you want to wait, you can get one, or order the NC now and pick up this week at a really good run-out-model price. It will be faster and better equipped than the ND, and because prices aren't final on the ND yet, we're not sure if it will actually be any cheaper (or at least that's what the NC customers will be told at this point). When they finally launch the ND they can drop the pants on the price to attract buyers who would have previously felt a modern convertible sports car was just too much $$ to own.

To use the argument that nobody cares how fast it goes is illogical - if you are saying people love it because of how it drives, then performance is part of that equation. When driving the 86 you do feel as if you are driving a fast sports car, and sure, it would be great to have it go faster, but the package of cheap/fun sport car clearly worked and it sold in large numbers because the combination of light weight, fast and affordable all worked.

It just seems like a gamble that they didn't have to make, accept for the old-NC price issue that could be the reason I guess.

Will be interesting to see if the ND orders are as high as Mazda expects. This gamble could be the last model for Mazda if this doesn't hit that target - I wonder how many they expect to sell to judge it as being successful ??

[rjastra2]

Attracting entry level buyers who will buy a higher margin higher spec model next time. Increased volumes means lower cost per unit overall.

Yes.
The suggested 13:1 comp might get wound up a bit.

If I read the article correctly I think they reduced the comp ratio to 12:1 get more power.

[speed]

Grant, Mazda did have a 1.8 when they released the na6. Agree with everything else you say. Guess they gotta flog the nc somehow.


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[gslender]

Grant, Mazda did have a 1.8 when they released the na6.

Yeah, but the B8 or BP was a newer engine at the time. They were probably told to use the older B6 1.6 for a risky project like this. With the B6 already in large numbers and used more widely (with Ford etc) and considering they had to make tooling changes to adapt it from transverse to inline it might have been the better decision to make.

After they saw the success, it became clear to make the 1.8 available, which in 4 years after launch, they did....

G

[Mr Morlock]

The development story of the MX5 is out there. In regard to the engine Isomura who was in charge of the development plan was told by his boss "do only enough work to convert the transverse mounted 323 engine for longitudinal layout, no more" They did a bit more like everything. Isomura also said "We were given no funds, and no resources for any work beyond this".

The engine and its power did not hold the vehicle back. Mazda including Bob Hall always said the MX5 was not just about power but some people don't accept this. Many punters have no idea of the tech specs.

We all know the Toybaru has been a good seller and a competitor but its not currently in the same class a fixed coupe is not a convertible.

Mazda is striking back with a car to win back buyers and clearly it has to be competitive - its pretty much that simple.

I know people like to state that higher volume means a quicker payback but rest assured that Mazda works out in advance what is their budget , what is their expected volume of sales, its selling price and how it us funded.

[speed freak]

Anyone seen the new wheels magazine? Got a write up about the ND mx5, most is the same as we've heard but they say it has a price tag starting from $37k and the Aussie version will have the 2.0 l skyactiv (134 kw, same as the 3 I guess) and the 1.5 is for the overseas model, sounds good to me

[JayMo]

The redline on the tachometer of one the NDs displayed at California was 7600rpm. That's the start of redline. Rev cutout is likely to be a few hundred higher, maybe 8000rpm. It's going to be a revvy little thing!

Geez, remember the days when a (stock) rotary had a red line that began at 6500, was lucky to crack 80 kw, and cracking into the high 8 seconds 0-100 was blisteringly fast?

Heck in 1985 the default family car du jour, a Commodore VK with the 12port head and varajet carby put out 86kw and had a redline at 5500rpm... But threw a belt at 5k so that was a bit academic...

We are getting spoiled!

a 2 liter Skyactive that revs to 7500 would be enough for 90% of folk

(I am just likely to be in that other 10 percent)

[Nevyn72]

Spotted in dark grey!