MONDA - the Honda Powered MX5

Chat to do with your MX5/Miata/Eunos Garage Ride(s).

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oztrackdays
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MONDA - the Honda Powered MX5

Postby oztrackdays » Sun Jun 01, 2014 10:55 am

Ahh the Internet the source of so many of the dumber and more expensive ideas/inspiration we have.

A yank had the idea and I inquired with the guy who now markets as http://www.kmiata.com/
his kit looks ok but no RHD was on his radar.

I had met Benny and Jimmy of BYP Racing a half dozen times at various track events, and after
seeing and being beaten by about a half dozen of their K swapped knuckle draggers I asked
them to do the feasibility of the RHD kit, I had a busted NB8B that I had bought to steal
the ABS from so we had ourselves an engineering mule and a spare K24 for dummy fitting.

We purchased the KMiata Gearbox Adaptor and it fit sweet as - First Hurdle TICK.

The big issue with this project is swapping the Hot and cold side from the BP engine,
this meant very tight 4-2-1 headers needed to be made we got them Mandrel bent
and they seemed to have turned out all right.

At this point I bit the bullet and bought a registerable 2000 NB8B and the swap was green lit.

The final major hurdle is that for RHD applications there is 0% possibility of keeping a wet sump,
so we got a UK supplier to make us a DRY SUMP kit (bugger it took 4 weeks to make it)

I hope this thread doesn't degenerate into "Slap a turbo on brosef" or that's a WASTE of Money rants,
short version is I think MX5 are a great chassis and only people who have never
experienced Honda engines could dispute they are superior and this should be the
best of both worlds even if it sure isn't a budget option.

It fits with many many millimeters to spare in all the key areas sometimes as many as 2 - 5 of the millimeters.

MONDA-its-in.jpg


I was keen on this engine swap to prove the upper limits of the Naturally aspirated performance for an MX5
with the K24/K20 Frankenstein motor we are using with OEM valvetrain and Camshafts
170 rwkw is quite common will post Dyno Numbers after the tuning is done, 200 rwkw is still achievable
and accessable. On that Hot Summers day when the turbo runners are thinking dare I risk running my
car today this setup will do a full tank of running with VTEC fuel economy thrown in.

byp_177rwkw.jpg


I was always inspired by this footage as well they also make around the 170 rwkw range

But then you cost out the build in time and money and not so attractive to me plus not
street legal in the country of lets have modified street cars OZ.
http://www.maruhamotors.co.jp/miata/parts/bp21lkit.html

For the purist that truly love driving their NA/NB chassis and are mulling the swap to an NC just for the
engine potential and the 2.3/2.5 MZR swap come for a run in this car I think you will be pleasantly surprised.

Owning a rather highly developed BP engine but knowing you can't have that level of BP engine and drive
to the shops is frustrating which is where Honda street-ability makes so much sense.

Final List of all parts used and costs will be completed in a week or two.
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M O N D A ... MX5 Powered by K24 Honda Power BUILD THREAD -> http://mx5cartalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=57&t=63786

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Bauer
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Re: MONDA - the Honda Powered MX5

Postby Bauer » Sun Jun 01, 2014 12:21 pm

I saw the kmiata site the other day. Looks gr8
cheers
Stu

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Re: MONDA - the Honda Powered MX5

Postby sailaholic » Sun Jun 01, 2014 12:28 pm

Thanks for sharing the detail have been watching the kmiata stuff for months and wondering about the RHD issues of sump and headers.

Totally agree with the thought behind the swap.


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Re: MONDA - the Honda Powered MX5

Postby Magpie » Sun Jun 01, 2014 12:35 pm

No complaints from me on somebody wanting to push natural aspirated limits. This sounds like it could be something for me in the future!

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Re: MONDA - the Honda Powered MX5

Postby Nevyn72 » Sun Jun 01, 2014 1:19 pm

Then again you could always go a bit silly with an NB SE like they did here in the US
http://www.mazda-speed.com/forum2/index ... 888.0.html

Spend somewhere over US$30K and have a dyno chart like this.....

Image
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Re: MONDA - the Honda Powered MX5

Postby little decks » Sun Jun 01, 2014 1:31 pm

Nevyn72 wrote:Then again you could always go a bit silly with an NB SE like they did here in the US
http://www.mazda-speed.com/forum2/index ... 888.0.html

Spend somewhere over US$30K and have a dyno chart like this.....


I think you've missed the point… it's not about what you could or couldn't do… it's what he wanted to do and did, appreciate it for what it is and start your own thread if thats what you are interested in

narita
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Re: MONDA - the Honda Powered MX5

Postby narita » Sun Jun 01, 2014 1:33 pm

This is very very amazing
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Dann


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oztrackdays
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Chev's Can't be Registered :(

Postby oztrackdays » Sun Jun 01, 2014 3:59 pm

LS1 swap was considered but NA,NB even NC don't have enough Tare Weight for 5.7 or greater engines
and being engineered, also multiple people have indicate that the relatively large torque from a Chev
will destroy wheel hubs, half shafts and the rest of the drive train so once you factor in the extra costs
from bringing all those components up to specification the cost really comes up higher.

Even the MX5 Turbos once the wick is turned up suffer driveline issues.
M O N D A ... MX5 Powered by K24 Honda Power BUILD THREAD -> http://mx5cartalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=57&t=63786

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Forced Induction - Is Still very possible.

Postby oztrackdays » Sun Jun 01, 2014 4:18 pm

In fact the K20A Turbo route is more bang for Buck even, it still needs the dry sump though.

If 300+ rwkw is wanted then I have the option of Turbo or Supercharged and it is still street legal
from power to weight and displacement rules perspective.

However having owned a 300+ rwkw Turbo RX7 in the past unless you are on quite large and fresh grippy tyres
on a nice warm track you end up just playing with the throttle instead of using it hard
and you the extra power is not a proportional gain for circuit duties and often beaten by the MX5's
which is what got me into mx5's in the first place.

The extra power and torque is really just a massive luxury on the big tracks like PI,Bathurst,EC
I am not expecting this car to be crazy quicker on the more technical tracks like Winton,MDTC etc ...
M O N D A ... MX5 Powered by K24 Honda Power BUILD THREAD -> http://mx5cartalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=57&t=63786

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Re: MONDA - the Honda Powered MX5

Postby Nevyn72 » Sun Jun 01, 2014 4:30 pm

So just to clarify, is this a dedicated track car or is it going to be road registered & dríven?

You mention a K20/24 frankenstien motor..... Which bits of each did you use and why?
"A Convertible has a top you can put down when the weather's nice...... A Roadster has a top you can put up when the weather's bad."

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Re: Chev's Can't be Registered :(

Postby tinsfci » Sun Jun 01, 2014 4:54 pm

oztrackdays wrote:LS1 swap was considered but NA,NB even NC don't have enough Tare Weight for 5.7 or greater engines
and being engineered, also multiple people have indicate that the relatively large torque from a Chev
will destroy wheel hubs, half shafts and the rest of the drive train so once you factor in the extra costs
from bringing all those components up to specification the cost really comes up higher.


One of the reasons I went with the LS for my race car is that most of the drivetrain is replaced with stronger parts, so hopefully reliability will higher (long term) than a hot engine- stockish drivetrain combination, and breaking the engine just means another trip to Pickles to get another one of the many SS Commodores that has found the trees sideways at high speed. The T-56 gearbag and Cadillac diff are meant for a car twice the weight so should be OK, driveshaft, halfshafts and hubs are all replaced with beefier units. Destruction of standard rear hubs seems to be more of an issue due to the wider tyres people tend to run on the V8's. I think rear suspension bushes and front hubs will be where I will have issues.

I'm not familiar with the evolution of Honda motors or what engine Civics have as standard, but there is a Civic that runs in Improved Production or Street Cars that is blindingly quick and regularly faster than Elises. Love the idea of this swap and look forward to seeing the results.
Street='94 with FFS Coldside. Sold :(
Race='97 with AVO (soon to be Absurdflow) and GT2560 <--- sod that... LS1 conversion underway!

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Re: MONDA - the Honda Powered MX5

Postby 16bit » Sun Jun 01, 2014 6:43 pm

Nevyn72 wrote:So just to clarify, is this a dedicated track car or is it going to be road registered & dríven?

You mention a K20/24 frankenstien motor..... Which bits of each did you use and why?


k24 bottom end because displacement and k20 head because flow.
98 evo gold - rotrexed and loving it.

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Re: MONDA - the Honda Powered MX5

Postby oztrackdays » Sun Jun 01, 2014 7:03 pm

This car was purpose built to allow me a rather non professional driver to do a sub 8 minute Nurburgring BTG run so it must stay registered. I accept it will be not that luxurious or comfy as a daily
M O N D A ... MX5 Powered by K24 Honda Power BUILD THREAD -> http://mx5cartalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=57&t=63786

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Re: MONDA - the Honda Powered MX5

Postby Magpie » Sun Jun 01, 2014 8:24 pm

oztrackdays wrote:I accept it will be not that luxurious or comfy as a daily

:BROADY: my way of thinking now! Are you having a stereo?

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Re: MONDA - the Honda Powered MX5

Postby oztrackdays » Sun Jun 01, 2014 9:16 pm

No stereo I have an iPhone and headphones.

Fellow NA/NB track nuts need your help with creative weight loss ideas.

-9 kg Lithium Phosphate battery
- ? To change hard top any waterproof CF option is of interest

The Honda swap removes
Over 20 kg over the front wheels and air con is already deleted.

What other creative options have people managed.
M O N D A ... MX5 Powered by K24 Honda Power BUILD THREAD -> http://mx5cartalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=57&t=63786


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