Cheap forced induction?

Lokiel · Postby **Lokiel** » Wed Oct 23, 2013 11:07 am

Here's an interesting+cheap forced induction idea:

http://www.performancechiptuning.com/Electric+Supercharger+5+PSI+Vortex/10/

Any thoughts on how effective it would be in an MX5 or would it simply overwhelm the OEM MAF sensor and OEM ECU?

I suspect an aftermarket ECU is also mandatory.

deviant · Postby **deviant** » Wed Oct 23, 2013 11:08 am

No.

That is all you need to know about that :mrgreen:

david_syd_au · Postby **david_syd_au** » Wed Oct 23, 2013 11:13 am

Remember the age old axiom:
"Cheap, effective, reliable. Pick any 2"

hks_kansei · Postby **hks_kansei** » Wed Oct 23, 2013 11:43 am

Lokiel wrote:Any thoughts on how effective it would be in an MX5 or would it simply overwhelm the OEM MAF sensor and OEM ECU?

I suspect an aftermarket ECU is also mandatory.

There's been plenty of tests out there on these things, pretty much all of them said the end result is either no change, or less power.

Think of it like this, look at the size of the motor on a pedestal fan, and look at the size of the blades.
Now think of how much air it moves.

These "electric turbos" and the like have much, much smaller motors, and much smaller fans, they move a lot less air (in fact, the vaccuum from the intake probably overpower the tiny motor and spins the blades more than the electric motor). They're basically a PC cooling fan.

Plain and simply, there's a reason nobody uses them.
If they worked as well as the dodgy sellers claim, don't you think every OEM car woudl be using them? better economy, more power, tiny size, and only needs two small wires? why wouldn't you use one!

Apu · Postby **Apu** » Wed Oct 23, 2013 11:48 am

I've seen these - there are some that can move a volume of air, but they can't pressurise it which is what the turbo and supercharger can do...so it won't work.

PaulF · Postby **PaulF** » Wed Oct 23, 2013 12:35 pm

Lol, nice try Lokiel.

Apu · Postby **Apu** » Wed Oct 23, 2013 1:27 pm

Doh...I no like be sucked in...

Muzdaman · Postby **Muzdaman** » Wed Oct 23, 2013 2:11 pm

I need to talk to Dann about re-routing the dash fan to my intake!

Snowmotion · Postby **Snowmotion** » Wed Oct 23, 2013 2:17 pm

Maybe watch the Mighty Car Mods video on this subject.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbGWgvJN1_8

Not much to say after that.

Lokiel · Postby **Lokiel** » Wed Oct 23, 2013 2:25 pm

PaulF wrote:Lol, nice try Lokiel.

Wasn't "trying" anything but fishing for thoughts/experience on this, that's what forums are great for.

I put this in the "eBay mod-chip category" (ie. sounds like it "may" work but doesn't live up to its claims).

I actually had visions of Dann choking on his breakfast Cornflakes while posting this

Thanks for the link Snowmotion.

hks_kansei · Postby **hks_kansei** » Wed Oct 23, 2013 2:43 pm

Lokiel wrote:I put this in the "eBay mod-chip category" (ie. sounds like it "may" work but doesn't live up to its claims).

The concept is sound, the engineering behind it not so much.

The concept of an electrically dríven fan that can provide boost comparable to a turbo is sound, but it relies on that fan being dríven very, very, fast (turbos spin at something like 100,000rpm, a fan usually at 5,000rpm)

The problem is that any motor small enough to fit in the intake tract can't spin that fast, or that hard.
And a motor powerful enough to do so would be much larger, and need so much current that once you've managed to get an alternator big enough to keep it running, the power is probably still a net loss.

The ebay chips work by making the mixture a bit more rich, which would only help if the mixture was leaner than ideal beforehand.

16bit · Postby **16bit** » Wed Oct 23, 2013 3:25 pm

the answer is no.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cbGWgvJN1_8

M1474 · Postby **M1474** » Wed Oct 23, 2013 4:17 pm

Ignoring the type of fan used here. If the alternator and fan motor were 100% efficient it would be on a par with a supercharger. Even then why would you add the complexity and not just run a s/c in the first place?

OurCognitiveSurplus · Postby **OurCognitiveSurplus** » Wed Oct 23, 2013 4:30 pm

The product linked would never work.

I understand that some companies are working on a product of (very very) roughly the same style. I.e. a turbo powered by electricity. I think the theory is that you power the turbo using waste heat rather than flow. Obviously this is a very serious and somewhat speculative engineering project not something you buy off ebay for $100.

hks_kansei · Postby **hks_kansei** » Wed Oct 23, 2013 4:43 pm

OurCognitiveSurplus wrote:The product linked would never work.

I understand that some companies are working on a product of (very very) roughly the same style. I.e. a turbo powered by electricity. I think the theory is that you power the turbo using waste heat rather than flow. Obviously this is a very serious and somewhat speculative engineering project not something you buy off ebay for $100.

Isn't that how a normal turbo works though?

Waste heat and gas (exhaust) is used to spin a turbine, that in turn spins another turbine that compresses air into the engine.

I imagine there would be a lot more losses in converting the energy from heat-electricity-rotation-compression, instead of the standard turbo method of heat/gas-rotation-compression

In saying that, they're engineers and I'm an accountant.
All I;m qualified to do is tell them "stop that, it costs too much!"