Final Turbo R&D + Leap of Faith?

MosieurCinq · Postby **MosieurCinq** » Sat Oct 19, 2013 5:58 pm

First off, would like to say that I love my little na6 mx-5, its a great car and is a ton of fun, but it just feels like there is something missing, it just may need a bit more oomph.
Now, I have never been one to chase massive power figures, or mod something to the point where it is just not comfortable or practical for everyday use, but there are a few things that i am going to try and change over the coming months.

One of these things is the possibility of a small turbo setup. Inspired (Like im sure any were) by NitroDann's turbo for under $2000, I started doing research into wear and tear, reliability, and every day usability.
This proposed setup increases almost 50% in power and (possibly more) in torque, (which provides the most strain on mechanical components.) Taking this into account I have figured in clutch, diff (In the future, as this 'small' increase in power/torque should be fine for the time being, considering no track work) injectors, and a few other necessity's for a swap like this, ontop of the 'included basics'. Because this will never be aimed to be a 300whp monster, keeping things within budget, and still being safe shouldn't be too hard.

So to begin finalizing my R&D I have a few questions:

From all that I can gather, running a stock TD04 on wastegate pressure (7psi-9psi depending on where you read) without an inter-cooler is fine, safe, and reliable as long as you can keep as much heat away from the system as possible. People have run these on other cars (but not as many on mx-5's as I can gather) without the I/C, can anyone give me any heads up on drive-ability, and what their opinions as a daily would be?

Understanding what needs to go into doing a conversion, what can people who have Turbo mx-5's or even S/C mx-5s say to everyday comfort and reliability, keeping in mind this will likely be a lot more simple in design than a $5k+ conversion.

And lastly, do you think it is worth it, in your opinion, from having been in/driving/owning one do you think the effort is worth the result?
Some people I have talked to disliked modifying their na6-na8 preferring it to be stock over modified however, all of them did own other higher performance vehicles, so they may have wanted it (Mx-5) for a different purpose.
What do YOU think? would you rather your car was NA again? or does the increase in performance make up for the shortcomings?

I am very curious to know what you think about your Turbo 5, or about them in general. I'm just trying to see if making the leap of faith is worth it, especially for a system that does not change the OEM feel too much

Ive tried to do as much searching and research as possible, so this is the stage where i want to see other peoples opinions, however any links to forums/posts/comments would be great as I will take all the info I can get right now!

I have read about legalities, and issues that people have had over the forums.
And this guy who was looking into it, but at this stage an AVO $6000 job, is both too expensive, and over the top compared to the modest install that I am looking at, aswell as the tuning of the n/a engine is not exactly possible as i reckon most things that could be done have already been done:
viewtopic.php?f=81&t=59812

NitroDann's under $2k Thread
viewtopic.php?f=81&t=58863

Regards
Rhys

bear2230 · Postby **bear2230** » Sat Oct 19, 2013 10:46 pm

Hey Rhys,

Do it. Don't even give it another thought. Call Dann, give him your car and some cash and collect it after a couple of weeks and drive home with the biggest smile on your face you've ever had.
Once you've smoked an SS in your little 100rwkw NA you will know what I'm talking about.

Richard.

M1474 · Postby **M1474** » Sun Oct 20, 2013 10:13 am

Throw an intercooler in to the mix, only an exta $100 and you will need intake piping anyway. No point doing it twice.

MosieurCinq · Postby **MosieurCinq** » Sun Oct 20, 2013 10:25 am

bear2230 wrote:Hey Rhys,

Do it. Don't even give it another thought. Call Dann, give him your car and some cash and collect it after a couple of weeks and drive home with the biggest smile on your face you've ever had.
Once you've smoked an SS in your little 100rwkw NA you will know what I'm talking about.

Richard.

Sounds like a pretty darn good reason!

M1474 wrote:Throw an inter-cooler in to the mix, only an exta $100 and you will need intake piping anyway. No point doing it twice.

I was considering a small I/C, possibly even a top mount from a wrx, keep it small and hidden to keep with the stealth idea of the project, just so it isn't outwardly noticable

KevGoat · Postby **KevGoat** » Sun Oct 20, 2013 4:12 pm

With the quality of product and pride of workmanship that I constantly read about and see on this forum from Dann ... if I was going turbo (or even a decent rebuild and n/a power for that matter) I wouldn't think twice about factoring in flight costs and driving the distance for him to fit and properly tune it ...

... and that drive back home ............. :twisted:

MosieurCinq · Postby **MosieurCinq** » Sun Oct 20, 2013 5:04 pm

All I ever read is good reports from him, and his work
And that drive home would be killer!

Just wondering if people have reports on everyday driveablity! Other than that im just sorting out insurance, and rego (which will be a pain)

I hope your back is better kev! From what ive seen you are out driving again?

speed freak · Postby **speed freak** » Sun Oct 20, 2013 5:33 pm

Everyday driveability would be improved greatly. Torque, which the 1.6 lacks would come in by around 2000 rpm and a slight twitch of your right foot and you will be on boost. For normal cruising around town you would actually work the car less due to the added power and torque and fuel consumption would be improved too and when your in the mood for some fun just plant your right foot and prepare to smile and laugh like a child haha.

I would highly recommend it, my MX5 is N/A at the moment but I had a swift gti that I put a turbo kit on, td04 turbo and the result was amazing huge amount of fun, it had around 100 kw atw so much easier to just cruise around as it only has a little 1.3 (but revs to 8000 rpm) so torque was greatly improved then you could smoke v8's when you were in the mood for it.

KevGoat · Postby **KevGoat** » Sun Oct 20, 2013 8:08 pm

MosieurCinq wrote:I hope your back is better kev! From what ive seen you are out driving again?

Yeah thanks, , I'm getting about a lot more lately. The odd day trip seems fine. Should come up your way one weekend soon and say hello

. But yeah, my back has certainly taken a long time to recover this time. Unfortunately we still had to cancel a driving holiday we'd planned over this two weeks. We were even hoping to get to the Vic weekly meet up and say hello while away, but unfortunately we had to accept it just wasn't up to it. At least I'm finally getting some work done on the car lately.

Now just need to get the engine knock sorted and finish a few more cosmetic improvements I want to do, then will be starting looking at more power myself

Sent from my GT-I9100T using Tapatalk

MosieurCinq · Postby **MosieurCinq** » Sun Oct 20, 2013 8:36 pm

Yeah! Let me know, I just had knee surgery, so I wont be able to drive for a bit, but when I can come up and we can go for a drive, be good to have a lift in an NB!

Great to know you are up and driving! But it does suck that you couldn't make it over the boarder!

You prefer NA power as opposed to forced induction don't you? So I guess cams, exhaust etc?

Rhys

KevGoat · Postby **KevGoat** » Sun Oct 20, 2013 10:04 pm

MosieurCinq wrote:
You prefer NA power as opposed to forced induction don't you? So I guess cams, exhaust etc?

Rhys

Yeah, a left over from my old modified 4's and V8 days. A turbo back then was the "cheat's" way ... :mrgreen:

But we'll see ...

Let me know when you are getting better and we'll organise a run somewhere :beer:

MrRevhead · Postby **MrRevhead** » Sun Oct 20, 2013 10:07 pm

Knee problems, back problems....you guys suit the stereotypical MX5 demographic....*jokes*

MosieurCinq · Postby **MosieurCinq** » Sun Oct 20, 2013 10:10 pm

MrRevhead wrote:Knee problems, back problems....you guys suit the stereotypical MX5 demographic....*jokes*

Man, and i'm only 19!!!

KevGoat · Postby **KevGoat** » Sun Oct 20, 2013 10:38 pm

MrRevhead wrote:Knee problems, back problems....you guys suit the stereotypical MX5 demographic....*jokes*

Funny thing ... we have a Tarago, an Echo, VT Commodore and the NB8A ... and the only car I've been able to get around in comfortably has been the MX! My Chiro can't believe I can even get in or out of it

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DanZig · Postby **DanZig** » Mon Oct 21, 2013 8:43 pm

Hey Rhys,

Like you I've been doing a lot of research and am even at the point where I essentially have most of what I require to do the conversion. I believe the conversion using good quality parts would most definitely be worth it however, I'm actually reconsidering whether I'll actually go through with it. The reason for doing so is due to my intentions with the car and I think it's something worth considering.

What are your intentions with the car? Just street, maybe hill climbs, autocross or track days?

I personally use mine for weekend, hillclimb and track work so I'm quite concerned about reliability without spending a lot of time off track with a sad bank account (moreso than it is). If I was specifically using it on the streets and not putting it under too much strain and heat I'd be slapping the turbo on in a heartbeat. There's a reason why they're so popular boosted.

If you are keen to go turbo perhaps also have a word to GSlender regarding ECU as he's great with the megasquirt's and getting yourself familiar with the ecu is a good starting point while your car's stock.

ivan · Postby **ivan** » Mon Oct 21, 2013 10:13 pm

I had my car blown by Dann a few months ago and so far I'm loving it. Mine was already a track dedicated car by this time but for the street it's completely drivable. You can just accelerate slowly and you can drive it without hearing it boost.

Heaps of fun on the track with the extra power! And for street you will have way more power than you should ever be able to utilise.

Still haven't got my tune completely sorted yet though. Don't expect everything to be perfect and you will end up spending more than you thought as there are always more things you can upgrade. There might be small teething issues but once you get through it and look after your car it's all worthwhile. In my case Dann has been helping even with talking to the tuner for me.

Having said all that I have only done one track day. Ask me about reliability in 6 months!