Hit pothole - 2 damaged original wheels on NB 1998 - advice?

[JBT]

[With the KU36's, Option 1 Garage suggested 34psi as a minimum .. with mine they both certainly do not feel 'hard' on the road and the NB handles perfectly on the track

I used to run 40psi in my Corolla Sportivo normal driving and on a trip 42psi - that was the recommended

Off topic - they suggested that to me too but I think it's too high (cold) for an MX-5. 34 and higher makes the car "skittish" over bumps and rough surfaces IMO. Mazda recommended cold pressure for the NC is 29 but I use 30-32 for normal duty and max 38 hot for the track. Any more than that hot and they start to go off.
Pressures for other makes isn't really relevant. For instance, the BMW has a recommended cold 32 front / 38 rear for daily duty / light loads and 38 front / 45 rear for high speed / fully loaded....and it works.

[de Bounce]

OK, found this thread and looks like Neway Wheel Repairs in Heidelberg West, Melbourne VIC could be worth a shot at around $80 each.
http://www.newaywheelrepairs.com.au/profile.html

I have used these guys a number of times and found them very good.
They will tell you if the rim can be repaired straight away.

[93_Clubman]

Don't worry about new ones from Mazda (if available), here's a set of four good used NB8A rims with old tyres for $200 in Melb:
viewtopic.php?f=44&t=59732

[aSimpleLife]

Don't worry about new ones from Mazda (if available), here's a set of four good used NB8A rims with old tyres for $200 in Melb:
viewtopic.php?f=44&t=59732

Thanks very much for taking the time to find those.
I need to learn to use the site better to work that out for myself - sorry for being so slack.

[MattR]

I would also be going the council, but be prepared to have to wear them down.

If you get photos of the pothole, it can be argued that the council has not met service standards as legally required by Councils in Vic now. Ask to see their Road Maintenance Policy, it has to be a public document. It will also spell out what acceptable level of service for each defect type and times to repair them are. From the size of the pothole it is pretty easy to estimate the age of the defect, ie one or two weeks or a couple of months by looking at the surface around the pothole and the pavement in the bottom of the pothole.

I would be asking Council to supply you with 2 rims as required, get price from Mazda for new and hit them up for that as well as two new tyres the same as you lost. If you have the receipts and can prove milage on them you will have a better chance of getting the full price paid to you.

This is what Council's public liability insurance is for, even if self insured and why they now have a RMP in place to reduced these premiums as they are showing the insurers what they are doing to minimise risk.

[greenMachine]

Shock absorbers are probably shagged. Hitting a pot hole with shagged shocks almost guarantees a bent wheel, maybe two, and a couple of tyres.

Just another something to soak up your surplus cash ...

[NitroDann]

Wait, wouldnt shagged shocks be LESS likely to bend a rim?

[aSimpleLife]

I would also be going the council, but be prepared to have to wear them down...
If you get photos of the pothole, it can be argued that the council has not met service standards as legally required by Councils in Vic now. Ask to see their Road Maintenance Policy, it has to be a public document. It will also spell out what acceptable level of service for each defect type and times to repair them are. From the size of the pothole it is pretty easy to estimate the age of the defect, ie one or two weeks or a couple of months by looking at the surface around the pothole and the pavement in the bottom of the pothole.
I would be asking Council to supply you with 2 rims as required, get price from Mazda for new and hit them up for that as well as two new tyres the same as you lost. If you have the receipts and can prove milage on them you will have a better chance of getting the full price paid to you.
This is what Council's public liability insurance is for, even if self insured and why they now have a RMP in place to reduced these premiums as they are showing the insurers what they are doing to minimise risk.

My Bridgestone tyre dealer told me a number of his customers have hit potholes in our Knox City Council recently and have been successful in their claims.
He also said that the claim has to be over $1000? Because that was their excess?
It seems to me the amount should be irrelevant?

One of my problems is that I didn't realise how severe the damage was, so by the time I went back to the pothole it had been filled in, so I have a pic of a "filled in" pothole
Another problem is that it's 2 weeks today since I hit the pothole. Because I just thought it would be a balancing and maybe a wheel alignment, and I had a lot of work on, I didn't rush to get it done.
I've also got 2 other matters I'm "working" through council with at the moment...not sure if that make's things better or worse

[aSimpleLife]

...Just another something to soak up your surplus cash ...

Thanks very much for that

But on a more serious note, thankyous again to everyone for their input.
It's been a big help. Before I posted this thread I was wondering what I was going to do next. Now I've almost got "too" many options

[greenMachine]

Wait, wouldnt shagged shocks be LESS likely to bend a rim?

No.

When the wheel hits the pot hole it accelerates down into the hole, then has to reverse and accelerate up incredibly fast as it hits the opposite side. With very little or no damping in the shock absorber it goes to full bump movement and stops suddenly as all the travel is used up. So you have a wheel/suspension movement with lots of energy, all that energy has to be dissipated somewhere FAST. The bump stop will take a tiny bit (if its not totally shagged too), the car will move up - but it has a lot of inertia and can't react fast enough. Only things left to give are the suspension arms, and the wheel.

[aSimpleLife]

Just an update - in case this thread is of use to others in future;

Spoke to Neway - current price is flat $104.50 inc gst
Usually same day service
You can drop the car off for the day.
Or they will switch the damaged wheel for the spare so you can keep driving for the day.
Or you can take the wheels off yourself and drop them off with tyres on.

Also spoke to my Bridgestone dealer who supplied and fitted the RE002's.
He said he thought claiming against the Bridgestone Tyre Road Hazard Warranty should be OK.
I didn't say yet that I haven't got the card that the website mentions you need.

[NitroDann]

Wait, wouldnt shagged shocks be LESS likely to bend a rim?

No.

When the wheel hits the pot hole it accelerates down into the hole, then has to reverse and accelerate up incredibly fast as it hits the opposite side. With very little or no damping in the shock absorber it goes to full bump movement and stops suddenly as all the travel is used up. So you have a wheel/suspension movement with lots of energy, all that energy has to be dissipated somewhere FAST. The bump stop will take a tiny bit (if its not totally shagged too), the car will move up - but it has a lot of inertia and can't react fast enough. Only things left to give are the suspension arms, and the wheel.

So you are suggesting that with LESS damping the wheel will receive MORE force?

Only if the hole is wide enough for the car to drop into it and hit a bump stop or something..?

Dann

[MattR]

Having the pothole filled in could work to your advantage as it could then be argued that council knew of the problem and have effectivthrown mitted fault by fixing the pothole. I would definately ring them up and have a chat.

I am now going through a similar issue with the tmr in Qld over a windscreen replacement as their temporary fix caused a stone to be thrown up by a passing car.

[greenMachine]

Wait, wouldnt shagged shocks be LESS likely to bend a rim?

No.

When the wheel hits the pot hole it accelerates down into the hole, then has to reverse and accelerate up incredibly fast as it hits the opposite side. With very little or no damping in the shock absorber it goes to full bump movement and stops suddenly as all the travel is used up. So you have a wheel/suspension movement with lots of energy, all that energy has to be dissipated somewhere FAST. The bump stop will take a tiny bit (if its not totally shagged too), the car will move up - but it has a lot of inertia and can't react fast enough. Only things left to give are the suspension arms, and the wheel.

So you are suggesting that with LESS damping the wheel will receive MORE force?

Only if the hole is wide enough for the car to drop into it and hit a bump stop or something..?

Dann

No, the force is the same, I am saying that if the shocks are shot, there is no/little damping (compared to a shock that is working properly). Without that damping (ie energy being absorbed), all the energy generated as a result of the wheel being accelerated upwards has to be dissipated elsewhere - as discussed above.

The only other variable is the energy absorbed by the tyre as it flexes. I don't know, but I suspect that what is absorbed is then released as the tyre returns to its proper shape (under the force of the air pressure inside, and perhaps the way the sidewalls are constructed). If that is so, there would be effectively no damping as a result of the tyre flexing; in theory, the rubber flexing will absorb some energy, but relative to the forces involved in a wheel hitting an obstruction at speed, I imagine that this would be so low as to be inconsequential.

[aSimpleLife]

Just to close off the story.

While I would have been happy to get my 2 damaged wheels rolled, a member from the site sold me a set of 4 wheels with reasonable tyres (not that I really need them) for around the same price as 3 wheels being rolled, it was closer to home and more convenient than 2 trips to the roller, and there was a small chance one or both of the wheels might not be repairable.
Good news was the tyres weren't damaged - at least that's what the Bridgestone dealer told me (unless he's trying to avoid the Bridgestone pothole replacement offer - so for $350 I'm back on the road with 2 good spare wheels (for next time and another set of tyres if I ever have the need.
In the end I didn't try to make a claim on the council - the price of my own carelessness - and I've already got 2 matters going with them and couldn't really muster the enthusiasm for a 3rd.

The car still doesn't feel the same - maybe just my imagination - while it still drives straight - it's feels like it now wants to wander at the front if you slightly move the steering wheel - could that be front shocker damage?
I figure from what I've read here it's a good investment to have it looked at including an alignment by someone who really knows these cars;
I have been searching the forum for recommendations and have found the following;
WideTread here in Ferntree Gully (Melbourne Vic) are 10 minutes walk from my house...but I used them recently for tyres on my van and wasn't happy with them......it is so convenient though.
Techsport - 29 Michellin Court Bayswater - Jeff & Zac - 9720 9300
Trackside Race & Rally - Kilsyth - Craig - 9761 5557
Computalign - 27 Metropolitan Ave Nunawading - 9878 2666
Pedders in Dandenong.
The others all seem a fair distance.
Any other suggestions?

Thanks again to everyone for all the help.