NC supercharger storys and lies

[deanb90]

don't get to caught up in the BS guys really

http://www.ripoffreport.com/motorcycles/dynotronics-inc/dynotronics-inc-dp-tune-inc-bo-a3ff1.htm
http://www.s1000rrforum.com/forum/bmw-s1000rr-general-discussion/8958-dynotronics-dp-tune-s1000rr-ecu-reflash-results-enjoy-one.html
http://www.zx-10r.net/forum/showthread.php?t=115200
http://www.s1000rrforum.com/forum/exhaust-fuel-delivery/9472-ecu-remap-where-get-done.html
http://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=473451
http://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=472692

See here's where the problem is. If i wanted to i could find something on the internet that says something bad about any company, even a faultless one.

I have learnt not to bother with all the reading on the internet written by people in front of there computers because if you do, you will not find one good product. If i believed everything posted on forums the final consensus would be that cars are bad and everything go's wrong.

The fact is that my car has been running for 8000kms with the SC and same dynotronics tune without one hiccup. I have dríven the car to it's full potential a number of times, i have went WOT countless times, not one problem

To be honest mate you have no right to create a thread to belittle a company that you do not have experience with, your opinion is purely based on others opinions on internet forums. Just take a step back

Now i am in no way affiliated with either of the companies, i just own one of there products and i am happy.

Cheers

[deanb90]

It's adding 20% more fuel under boost so i don't understand the "lean" issue.

hey dean, just curious. How did you find out it is adding 20% more fuel?

That's what Daniel told me

[deanb90]

The stock ecu is able to pull significant amounts of timing on knock detection to save the engine.

What Im saying that that an N/A engine pulls in 14.7psi of air from the atmosphere, you are adding 10psi extra, thats 65% more air, and only adding 20% more fuel.

Thats 37% too lean.

Now the supercharger heats the air up, which expands it, so it isnt really 65% more air, it might be 50%, but you are only adding 20% more fuel.

It just isnt right.

Dann

Don't know Dan, according to the guru's it's fine. Many people are running the same flash with no problems. See this is my point, people can't go and say "x is ripping everyone off" just because this person say's hes tune is bad.

[neilhr]

dean if I was you I would get a data logger and see the numbers for myself. '20% more fuel' could mean alot of things. But it seems you are quite happy to keep your head in the sand?

[NitroDann]

Im not saying that anyone is bad, Ive no relationships with any of these guys so I cannot say what or who or how they are.

What I can say is that you are the only guy Ive spoken to who says his car runs fine, and only very select few in the business, all of whom stand to profit from saying so, say the tune is good, and that regardless of the truth, whats being said to customers is wrong like 20% extra fuel.

If somebody said that, they are either lying, simply dont know, or the naysayers are right about the safety of the tune and how it works.

Any of these things tell you something is up.

Dann

[Sailor]

Begs the question.
How many Supercharged NC owners have you spoken to?

Seems there are quite a few chiming in here who have never tuned an NC, have very little idea of the workings either of the Cosworth/FM supercharger setup or the Mazda PCM.
Maybe when they get a little more knowledge they'll be smarter than the guys with lots of knowledge and experience.

Having said that, there were plenty of problems with installs in the past and a few are still cropping up like vacuum leaks and bypass valves not working properly BUT I'm not aware of any recent engine failures.
I'd really like to hear if there have been any !!

BTW Neil datalogging is not the be all when done by an amateur.
I know it took me quite a while to get consistent logs with my Dashdyno for Mike at MotoEast to use.
A comprehensive dyno run is far more likely to find tune problems that might munch an engine then data laog to find 'drive' problems.
Was it Dean's car that went on my local dyno after the install?

[deanb90]

Something very well may be up, but for now i am going to trust what Daniel has told me, which is that the car is SAFE.

How many peoples cars have died with the dynotronics tune? I have only heard of one which was a long long time ago. My car has been running for ages with the same tune (8000kms), i have never had any CEL, idle is rock solid, only on really cold morning it rev hunts until warm. I am a happy customer.

[greenMachine]

Something very well may be up, but for now i am going to trust what Daniel has told me, which is that the car is SAFE.

How many peoples cars have died with the dynotronics tune? I have only heard of one which was a long long time ago. My car has been running for ages with the same tune (8000kms), i have never had any CEL, idle is rock solid, only on really cold morning it rev hunts until warm. I am a happy customer.

FWIW, I am with Dean (and Sailor) here.

I have been following the debate closely here and on the big board, and frankly I am confused with all the assertions flying around. I have experience with stand-alone ECUs, so I know something about tuning, but I need something to cut through the claims and counter-claims. So I ask myself, if so-and-so's tune is so crap, where are the failures? Someone's engine was lunched in the pursuit of power is the only one I can see, and the owner doesn't blame the tune for that even.

Now I ask myself is this just another internet hysteria thread, possibly fuelled (sorry ) by tuners trying to grab/defend market share? My tentative answer to that is 'yes', until and unless the blown engines start appearing (caused by the tune).

Having said that, if the debate brings out more information about the workings of Mazda's black box that will be very useful, but it seems that it would be at the price of (perhaps? probably?) unneccessarily worrying people about the safety of their car's tune.

Please note, my interest is purely academic (for the moment anyway), as I do not have an NC let alone a reflashed ECU.

[Charlie Brown]

First up let me say I know NOTHING about ECU’s or tuning stock or FI NC’s. It’s a science that obviously only a few have mastered which is why it has taken over 6 years to get to the point where there are just a few company’s that now are able fiddle with the tune maps.

I have a Dynotronics flash on my non FI NC that needs a tweak as it hunts a little on neutral throttle but that’s to be expected as everyone’s performance bolt on bits are different and the tune supplied was generic. I’m sure after I have the time to log a dyno run, the ECU will be tweaked to fix this minor problem. In the mean time I am enjoying the extra power that the flash has added.

Next, I’ve been reading with interest the posts from in this thread and on Miata.net about tunes and tuners and find the posters fall into a number of categories:

1. Those that have supercharged NCs but are unhappy with the tune and service from Dynotronics,
2. Those that have supercharged NCs and are happy with the tune,
3. Those that seem to have an agenda to push but hide behind a board name,
4. Those that think they know all about NC’s, superchargers, turbos and everything else in life and add little value to the discussion.

For the boys in #1 like Neil and Tim with problems, I, like others, sympathise with your plight and hope you find the right tune that will give your engine a long and trouble free life.

For those in #2, Enjoy. I drove Dean’s car on Sunday and it was fantastic. With my limited knowledge, the car felt great. It idled smoothly, pulled with beautiful linear power up to 6,000rpm before the conditions (speed) meant I needed to slow. Not a ping in sight under full throttle.

For those in #3, who’s only posts are those on this subject and intended to run down Dynotronics and their agent, its getting pretty boring rehashing the same thing over and over. How many turboed NA/NB's are there running around in AU that aren't compliant? These posts remind me of the Facebook trolls currently making the headlines.
Dean’s 8,000 kilometres of happy motoring on this engine is defying the nay sayers. Every considered that maybe he has a good tune? But then that’s not the reason behind your posts is it.

For those in #4, Dynotronics with Mazda’s blessing have flashed the entire NC field running in the Mazda Cup series in the US. Seems that’s pretty high regard for his work. Truth be known he's probably over run with work which is why sometimes it takes a while for some to get a response. What’s your claim to fame?

It would be interesting to know how many supercharged NC’s there are in the US, EU & AU.
Then how many ECU’s have been reflashed successfully, how many have failed and who supplied the tune.
Only then could an informed decision be made on which tuners are knowledgeable and worthy of our money and praise.

[deanb90]

I am glad some people are looking at it from a broad perspective.

It's wrong to belittle a company with hand full of only opinions of others. Yes there is raw data in spreadsheet form provided by someone on here but again that brings me back to the point of how many have blown up from dynotronics tune? If it were that bad, wouldn't my engine be gone, or atleast showing signs of being gone? To answer my own question, no, it runs really well.

Now i am far from a tuner so i am using the clear facts to make my own judgement

Dead SC NC's - 1
Alive NC's - 100+~?

99% are running dynotronics tune.

Makes it really hard to believe someone who says the tune will destroy your engine and "DO NOT GO WOT" "YOUR CAR IS UNSAFE"

I mean common..

[NitroDann]

I cannot read hex, so sending me a flash file and a stock file wont help, and I have never said I think bad things about any business's on either side of the fence, however some of the things dont make sense, a few people are having issues that indicate lean tunes, and we know that none of these are legal, which IS a genuine concern for someone with 40k value on their insurance.

It doesnt surprise that the stock ecu is able to limp the car hard enough to stop engine from blowing up either.

I think that the flash is great and its the way of the future, however nobody on the forum prior to these recent discussions let anyone know that some of the cars aren't right and that none have been or are getting engineered.
I think its important that this info is out in the open.

I mean it would be very bad if someone was led along for a 10k ride only to have to put their pride and joy up for sale due to legality or issues with competence of the tune.

Dann

[Suspense]

none have been or are getting engineered.

My understanding is that both Neil and Tim are in the process of getting their's engineered.

[deanb90]

I cannot read hex, so sending me a flash file and a stock file wont help, and I have never said I think bad things about any business's on either side of the fence, however some of the things dont make sense, a few people are having issues that indicate lean tunes, and we know that none of these are legal, which IS a genuine concern for someone with 40k value on their insurance.

It doesnt surprise that the stock ecu is able to limp the car hard enough to stop engine from blowing up either.

I think that the flash is great and its the way of the future, however nobody on the forum prior to these recent discussions let anyone know that some of the cars aren't right and that none have been or are getting engineered.
I think its important that this info is out in the open.

I mean it would be very bad if someone was led along for a 10k ride only to have to put their pride and joy up for sale due to legality or issues with competence of the tune.

Dann

I do agree with you Dan, my comment about belittling business's was not directed at you. But there are previous comments from some members that do seem that way.

But hey, you could be very right about the ecu being able to limp the car enough to stop it from blowing up.


I think i have said enough anyway.

Cheers guys and goodluck.


p.s it is no surprise my car did not sell! i never saw this thread until yesterday

[deanb90]

none have been or are getting engineered.

My understanding is that both Neil and Tim are in the process of getting their's engineered.

from my understanding one is 99% finished.

[NitroDann]

Im very glad you are able to keep your car also mate.

Have fun, good luck.

Dann