Please share experience with Cam work and ECU upgrade for NB

[deviant]

I guess the real holy grail is drivability in the form of linear power delivery and stock level throttle response. If someone can come up with a package that can do that then they'll sell bucket loads.

Despite the fact that mucking around with an ecu and cams is not legal, it would very unlikely that any insurance company will spend the effort dismantling your engine to check if your cams have been altered. Where as in a turbo or sc scenario, say if you had a crash it would be dead obvious that there is a turbo or sc in there. So as they say in the stock market, it's not an elimination of risk that I am after but the management of risk.

That is why fi route is not for me until we can get something legalized because to me, sure fi installed is okay until you have a major accident and are liable for crashing into a BMW or a building.

We need someone in Melbourne to take the lead in being an expert in ecu and cams install and tuning for mx5.

Declare it to your insurer anyway. Even though my cars have never been engineered or have 'illegal' modifications Shannons have been okay with me naming them on my policy with a few caveats.

[elitee]

Thanks for the info Dan, will speak to wazza

[miatalim]

Dan,

Please comment on any fuel consumption changes if any?

[miatalim]

Spoke to Tighe Cams. There is always someone answering the phone over there and they are pretty damn friendly and helpful. To get new cams cost $1000. And the guys said I would just have to drop it in to get it to work. I prefer a local solution. Where is Wazza ?

[wozzah1975]

Hi guys,

I'm briefly reading over this over my lunch break, BUT I will answer all PM's and questions when I get home.

I am based in Vic, Just over an hour from Melb. for those people who have asked.

Cheers,
Woz

[wozzah1975]

Can you explain more woz? The people I had talked to said valve springs were the limiting factor above 9mm (0.354")

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In my experience, the standard valve spring will cope anything up to .370" lift, providing the ramps on the cam aren't too aggressive. My grinds are specifically done to suit the standard spring, and I have a number of customers running there cars up to 8000rpm, and I have had no issues (even in boosted applications).

Cheers,
Woz

[wozzah1975]

Yah I got the springs are need for the longer valve lift, I'm interested in the port not being able to cope with the additional lift.

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Ok, on most engines there is a given point of valve lift where the port becomes the restriction. In other words, once you reach this point it doesn't matter how much further you open the valve, the port will not flow any more air, as the shape and size of the port becomes the restriction to the air flow/air speed.

On a BP, without having my flow charts in front of me, this happens at around .360" valve lift. After that point there is very little/no gain in air flow, so it is pointless using cams with more lift. All bigger cams will do at that point is make the engine have less low/mid power, and gain no more power up top. Any bigger in the cams requires the head to be ported to utilise the extra valve lift.

I hope that explains it.

Cheers
Woz

[sailaholic]

Cheers that sorts it.

How much porting would be need for the next useful "Step" and what would an indicative price for that to happen.

Happy to talk more via email /phone on specific but thought most would be interested in the above as a minimum.

Cheers nick.

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[wozzah1975]

Cheers that sorts it.

How much porting would be need for the next useful "Step" and what would an indicative price for that to happen.

Happy to talk more via email /phone on specific but thought most would be interested in the above as a minimum.

Cheers nick.

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It depends on a few things, but to give you an idea, the last head/cam package I did was about the $1400 mark (I was sent the complete head off the car, and delivered it back ready to bolt on). It was an early BP HLA style head.

The work that was carried out was to fully reco (cleaned, new guides, valve seats cut, surface cyl head) and port the cylinder head to spec using the standard valves, then assemble it ready to bolt on). This particular one just used the .363" lift cam kit. This sort of head combined with sensible intake and exhaust mods will make about 110-115rwkw, BUT the difference in the entire power curve is much better. If you compared it to the same cams in a standard head then entire power curve is higher, and at certain RPM points there has been up to a 20kw increase. The torque curve is also wider and more consistant, so throttle response is also improved.

Cheers
Woz

[miatalim]

There you go. We've got our Victorian expertise now. If people are willing to travel 6 hrs to get their exhaust fitted then I don't see why they would not do the same with more substantial mods like cams. I'll take a big dip into this and let you know whether it's worthwhile.

[NitroDann]

Lol, and tell us if cams are worthwhile.

I can answer that, so can most WRXs

Dann

[miatalim]

Lol, and tell us if cams are worthwhile.

I can answer that, so can most WRXs

Dann

Yeah...but I am talking about work on a real sports car.

[NitroDann]

no wrxs have cams, Im talking about the wrxs Ive raced, who now understand that cams are worth it.

Dann

[miatalim]

Wow...no turbo miata beating a awd turbo monster. Are you sure your power ain't peaky like the vtec engines ?

[NitroDann]

PM
xatz
spikes
paul f
muzdaman

and ask them.
I didnt say STI, I said wrx.
Also have beaten a 23psi, HDi front mount, tomei procams, 3 inch turbo back exhaust, powertune flash tuned evo7, that was auto, from a 2nd gear roll. The similarly specd Evo 6.5 Tommi makinen Edition that was manual beat me in the same 3 car pull.

Do the math, 120rwkw and under 900kg for an NA with the engine Wazzah is describing. Its 135kw/tonne at the wheels. Its not heaps but its enough.

Dann