Gear changes a bit crunchy.....

[Silvia]

"It's not a problem and there are no reasons."

Perhaps you mean "I do not have a problem"?
There's an awful lot of people around here who DO have an MX 5 gearbox problem and would like to know why. I doubt they are all imagining it.....and this thread is all about trying to fix the problem. Isn't that reasonable?

[NitroDann]

Well no its not reasonable.

It simply isnt a problem.

There are tens of thousands of these gearboxes, exactly the same in many different cars. Guess what? You arent the first to say that second gear baulks when cold. And you all wont be the las to talk about it for 2 weeks and give up, or put in some magical super additive and lul yourselves into believing its fixed it. The truth is that if there was a super additive, the good quality oem approved, off the shelf castrol/mobil/whatever products would already contain it. Or they would at least have a formulation with the additive package available.

The fact is that it baulks when its cold, and if you abuse it it clacks, just like any box thats pushed into gear rather than let it go at its own pace.

There are just so many of these useless 10 page gearbox oil threads all over miata.net, CR, mx5cartalk etc, that if you had been around a while youd know that there is no solution. Guess where there isnt these threads? Over at no BS MT.net. The fact is that theres no cure, and ffs there is hardly an issue to cure.

That was my last post here, im out.

Dann

[Aussie Stig]

Just to make certain that everybody is on the same page, how often should you change your gearbox oil

Is there any real need to do it as the box is a sealed unit, does it wear out.

Having come from FWD cars exclusively I have never done it, so I would appreciate the input.


Probably the same applies to brake and clutch both sealed systems but these are hydroscopic so there may be a difference.

I guess there is a service interval, do you racers do it more frequently?

[mazdatenfive]

My thoughts are.
There is an art to changing gears.
Don't rush your changes until the car has warmed up.
It appears that rushing gear changes can beat the synchro and this is possibly the root of the crunching.

[JBT]

Just to make certain that everybody is on the same page, how often should you change your gearbox oil

Is there any real need to do it as the box is a sealed unit, does it wear out.

Having come from FWD cars exclusively I have never done it, so I would appreciate the input.


Probably the same applies to brake and clutch both sealed systems but these are hydroscopic so there may be a difference.

I guess there is a service interval, do you racers do it more frequently?

The MX-5 gearbox is not sealed and the oil is normally changed in most manual gearboxes about every 60,000-80,000 km - see the service booklet. Astina (FWD) scheduled at 80,000km but done earlier by dealer due claimed change in service interval by Mazda. NC scheduled every 100,000 km. The NC is tracked/hillclimbed etc., has done 56,000km on original transmission oil and works fine.

[Silvia]

When we talk of everybody being on the same page - there are obviously some who have not had the problem , so dismiss others as imagining it, or changing gears too fast , or being too fussy.
But as a driver of numberless vehicles over 50 years , I can relate to so many other MX 5 drivers who have reported real problems with the gear changes.
I have them in my newly bought 2002 and have learned so much from attempting to find a fix. Turrets,boots,shift sticks and knobs, bottom bearings,clutch adjusters, types of oil,change frequencies etc. are now much better understood and I thank forum members who have contributed. Some have taken their bat and ball and stomped off slamming the door when they could have just abstained, some have denied the problem or thought it natural, but I for one enjoy the interchange and education and am about to start my program of applying it on "Silvia" this week...

[Steampunk]

Okay, you may call this a useless comment, but when Dann and JBT said "...it's not a problem" they mean "it's not something of concern as it is an inherent characteristic".

You mentioned that you know of many people who have it, and others have stated the same, so it's "typical" and NOT a sign that something is breaking or faulty.
Since your car has relatively low mileage, you might be getting a bit paranoid when others stated that they have "a real problem" changing gears, but their cars would more likely than not have considerably higher mileage or other concerns, eg. worn engine mounts.

I personally have not experienced baulkiness (spelling) on any MX-5 that I've dríven, but that definitely does not mean I am saying it doesn't happen or they are imagining it.

Just to give another example, useless as it may be, if you care to remember the old Suzuki Swift GTi, no matter how old or new the car is (had friends with older ones and one who bought one of the last batch), regardless of cold or warm, when doing a faster-than-normal 1st-to-2nd gear change it will always crunch. I thought it was my mate's lack of skill and experience with the car, but I drove it and no matter the situation, even idling with the clutch depressed well in advance, it crunches.
My mate was unhappy and as concerned as you are, but when told, "it just does it" by the Gti gurus, he accepted it.

So, "it's not a problem" is a legitimate, non-cynical, answer.
Would you have felt better if someone else said "your 2nd gear synchro is worn and needs replacing" ?

PS: as for Mazda's quality control, not that I've dríven any, but have you heard airs and graces being said about Ferrari's manual boxes? quite the opposite, and yet ...

PPS: I don't use any Redline lubricants. Gearbox had some sort of Pennzoil product (it was many years ago that it was changed) with Nulon G70.

[Aussie Stig]

Just to make certain that everybody is on the same page, how often should you change your gearbox oil

Is there any real need to do it as the box is a sealed unit, does it wear out.

Having come from FWD cars exclusively I have never done it, so I would appreciate the input.
Probably the same applies to brake and clutch both sealed systems but these are hydroscopic so there may be a difference.

I guess there is a service interval, do you racers do it more frequently?

The MX-5 gearbox is not sealed and the oil is normally changed in most manual gearboxes about every 60,000-80,000 km - see the service booklet. Astina (FWD) scheduled at 80,000km but done earlier by dealer due claimed change in service interval by Mazda. NC scheduled every 100,000 km. The NC is tracked/hillclimbed etc., has done 56,000km on original transmission oil and works fine.

The MX5 gearbox is not sealed? So where is the source of contaminants
Non technical guess is maybe microscopic particles from the gears but maybe it is the clutch and gear turret.

LOL about Ferarri quality control. It was virtually non existent, at least while the old man was still making them. Drop dead gorgeous cars, though.
I can understand Silvia's frustration as the MX5 is such a sweetheart of a car.

[NitroDann]

I consider the crunchy gearbox complaint to be similar to the oem radiator splits complaint.

Mx5s are known to have radiator issues, they are notoriuos for splitting, am I right?

Now any car at 20 years old with plastic radiators will split but have you ever heard of notorious Hyundai radiators?
The reason that people complain about mx5 radiators is because the whole rest of the car is sooooooo soooooooo damn bulletproof that we get an unrealistic expectation of quality, so rather than say mx5 radiators are the only bit that will die in 20 years of abuse, we say watch out ofr mx5 radiators, they break.

Its because the whole driving experience is so unbelievably good that we hear complaints about baulking that you wouldnt notice in a commodore or corolla. 1red5 is spot on, when I say its not a problem, I mean 'Yours isnt the only one, and people dont experience gearbox failure as a secondary symptom of a baulking-when-cold gearchange'.

Dann

[Silvia]

Welcome back Dann

[NitroDann]

Yeah... I know :p

Dann

[manga_blue]

I've had my car long enough to have a reasonable history of gear oils through it. Basically different oils have given my gearbox very different characteristics.

1. The car had filthy black old oil when I bought it. The box was pretty noisy. It was probably the original oil. Nevertheless it sort of functioned, just a bit crunchy

2. I changed to Redline MT90 very early on. All the gear noise disappeared but the bearing noises remained. The shift action was really good but still some little baulks, no crunches. Adjusting driving style mostly fixed them. Replacing the diff and broken front engine mounts with MazdaSpeeds did the rest.

3. After 2 years I decided it was getting time to change, this time to Castrol Syntrans. Big mistake. It baulked on pretty much every change and the car was undriveable. Even just pottering around town I couldn't slot it into a gear. I had to give up after a about week and drain it out.

4. Next to go in was Redline MTL. The box sounded like it was running on sewing machine oil, just way too thin. A lot of the old gear noise came back, there was no baulking but it was very notchy, hot or cold.

5. With an engine re-build we decided to strip the box and found all the bearings needed replacing, which was pretty much what I thought when I bought it. That done, it was filled with some Italian premium synthetic from Bruno's storeroom. Felt good with good shift action.

6. Operator brain snap at 180kmh and a missed 5/4 shift followed by panic led to a very worrying lose and a broken selector which locked out 5th. Bought Ashley's gearbox and filled it with Royal Purple because it was there. Felt pretty average and sounded pretty average too. Thought the box was more worn than it should have been. Had unkind thoughts about Ashley's car for the next year.

7. Refilled with Redline MT90 almost 2 years ago, felt brilliant, just like a new gearbox, haven't missed a shift since.

[JBT]

...The MX5 gearbox is not sealed? So where is the source of contaminants
Non technical guess is maybe microscopic particles from the gears....

Correct Metal on metal wearing. The oil also age deteriorates.

[Silvia]

Particles from the gears enter the oil in a sealed OR unsealed gearbox.

[NitroDann]

The gears are submerged in the oil.

Dann