DDM CAI Feedback on NB

miatalim · Postby **miatalim** » Sun Feb 13, 2011 11:34 pm

Just got my DDM CAI installed at Sport Essentials. It would have taken me 3 hours so I though it would be easier to pass it to Dean which he only charged me $35 for. He did a great job.

To cut a long story short, I felt that the CAI added zero appreciable difference to the performance of my car. Today wasn't a particularly cold pr hot day so it would probably represent a good day to test the car.

In fact, it actually feels like the car has lost some mid range pulling power. I still cannot work out if there is sufficient air coming through the front area into the box so maybe the CAI is starved of air.

I should have followed my instinct and gone for the cowl CAI like I did with my NA. In theory the cowl area should properly isolate the intake from the engine bay and feed proper cold air..
Does anyone with a DDM CAI feel like they have lost some mid range torque?

So far, it seems like there is very little you can do to increase power on an NB...the exhaust system change seemed to make the biggest difference.

jerrah · Postby **jerrah** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 12:35 am

So far, it seems like there is very little you can do to increase power on an NB.

Tried this? http://flyinmiata.com/index.php?dept=34

I'm not sure if exhaust/intake modifications really give much power on any modern car. It's mostly for the sound and the perception of speed.

rascal · Postby **rascal** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 9:54 am

miatalim wrote:...., I felt that the CAI added zero appreciable difference to the performance of my car. Today wasn't a particularly cold pr hot day so it would probably represent a good day to test the car.

So far, it seems like there is very little you can do to increase power on an NB...the exhaust system change seemed to make the biggest difference.

I have a true CAI on my otherwise stock engined car, and when I had the stock intake temporarily installed for one meeting, the difference was noticeable only above 6k rpm. It just went a bit flat at the very top rev range. Otherwise it didn't feel any different.

As others have suggested, without internal mods to make the best use of it, exhaust and intake mods will provide modest gains at best..
As an example, my car has true CAI, hiflo cat & 2.5" straight thru exhaust and only has 7kw more than it did std.. (And only above 4Krpm. Between 2.5K & 4K it puts out less than stock.)

93_Clubman · Postby **93_Clubman** » Wed Mar 02, 2011 12:20 pm

miatalim wrote:In fact, it actually feels like the car has lost some mid range pulling power.

Does anyone with a DDM CAI feel like they have lost some mid range torque?

This normal if you replace the OEM intake engine crosspipe & it has a Helmholtz resonator hanging off it, as the resonator flattens out a mid range torque dip.

miatalim · Postby **miatalim** » Wed Mar 02, 2011 4:36 pm

Perhaps an adaptable ECU will make better use of the intake and exhaust mode by tailoring the fuel mixture to the new mods via dyno tuning??

I just haven't heard a lot of positive points about upgrading ECU or turbo and most post I read seem to suggest that you do lose a lot of OEM driveability which I am not willing to trade in for as I use my MX5 on the street 100%.

rascal · Postby **rascal** » Wed Mar 02, 2011 5:23 pm

miatalim wrote:Perhaps an adaptable ECU will make better use of the intake and exhaust mode by tailoring the fuel mixture to the new mods via dyno tuning??

I just haven't heard a lot of positive points about upgrading ECU or turbo and most post I read seem to suggest that you do lose a lot of OEM driveability which I am not willing to trade in for as I use my MX5 on the street 100%.

Most references to loss of OEM drivability are when mods are performed but the ECU stays factory. It wasnt designed to operate with the new parameters and so drivability suffers. Almost all issues can be negated with an upgraded ECU and a good tune(r)..

It also depends on what you want from the mods, as in my instance I'm happy to cop the mid range dip for the top end gain, as mine lives above 5K rpm so I don't really care about any sub 4K losses..

Regie · Postby **Regie** » Wed Mar 02, 2011 7:54 pm

i noticed a little torque drop in the mid range when i had mine installed, But at a Dyno day a few years ago now, i was pulling around 8rwkw more than stock 8B's and i just had the intake installed.

other than that, how freaking good does it sound!!!!

ForceMajeure · Postby **ForceMajeure** » Wed Mar 02, 2011 9:53 pm

miatalim wrote:Perhaps an adaptable ECU will make better use of the intake and exhaust mode by tailoring the fuel mixture to the new mods via dyno tuning??

I just haven't heard a lot of positive points about upgrading ECU or turbo and most post I read seem to suggest that you do lose a lot of OEM driveability which I am not willing to trade in for as I use my MX5 on the street 100%.

Are you using iridium spark plugs and 8/8.5mm quality leads such as magnecors with this combo?

miatalim · Postby **miatalim** » Wed Mar 02, 2011 10:16 pm

Wow..I have noticed extra ommphh with the colder Melbourne weather we have been experiencing...I even managed to chirp the wheels when taking off. Perhaps the CAI is able to really suck in the cold air whereas stock will just be getting warmer air from headers nearby ??

Jury is still out on effectiveness of CAI.

I have suck $3k into my MX since Dec 2010 so I had better give it a rest for awhile. Just got a GoPro HD camera so having a lot of fun with that in the car.

I still cannot find enough consensus that an ECU upgrade like Adaptronic is a big improvement over stock.

rascal · Postby **rascal** » Thu Mar 03, 2011 9:04 am

miatalim wrote:...I even managed to chirp the wheels when taking off.

hmm, from standstill, push right foot to floor, lift left foot quickly, much more than chirping to be had... :lol:

miatalim wrote:I still cannot find enough consensus that an ECU upgrade like Adaptronic is a big improvement over stock.

Unless you are doing breathing mods to the engine as well as your CAI and exhaust, then apart from being able to delete the AFM (for the 0.5 hp advantage that gives) the only advantage I see with an Adaptronic or similar ecu is the ability to smooth out your tune to get rid of the dips in the power curve and give a few kws that the std ecu will be holding back. You wont get massive gains from the ecu otherwise.

93_Clubman · Postby **93_Clubman** » Thu Mar 03, 2011 1:07 pm

miatalim wrote:I just haven't heard a lot of positive points about upgrading ECU or turbo and most post I read seem to suggest that you do lose a lot of OEM driveability which I am not willing to trade in for as I use my MX5 on the street 100%.

StanTheMan recently posted some of his aftermarket ECU experience on his NA6, which you might have read: viewtopic.php?f=29&t=45834&start=15
STM's second post on the above page contains more detail & his conclusion in relation to his NA6 was:

StanTheMan wrote:For a race car. It's worth while because its either all or nothing. Unlike a steetcar where drivability comes important. I like the idear of a piggy back. Where idle & a few other things still get taken care of by the stock ecu.

I think, & am sure STM will correct me, that when he says 'piggy back' he's talking parralell ECUs, as opposed to a piggy back interceptor.

Maybe OEM driveability would be easier to achieve on the NB8A? Or maybe variable TPS would have helped in STM's case - I'm not sure, but he certainly gave it a good go.

That said, there's that Sydney NB8A that has:
TODA cams & adjustable cam gears
Trust/Greddy Emanage piggy back (interceptor)
Tuned by Matt at Hitman Tuning
MX5 Mania CAI
viewtopic.php?f=73&t=44537

This should cost less all up, but not sure it would give you the power you want. Perhaps PM Mason.