NA6 Bilsten/King Springs RATTLING MY TEETH!!!

[Dweezle]

Is there a way to tell spring rates etc by ooking at the shock/spring?
I can not see any identifiable marks, though they are dirty and obviously still in the car.

AT Wakefield these felt great.
Driving to work and back, is absoultly back breaking.
The car just slams and crashes its way over bumps.

Makes my previous cars Koni Coilovers feel like a cloud.

I am happy to change springs, but have no idea what i should be aiming for.
Or if it is even the springs or the shocks that are so stiff, or both off course?

I had the car aligned at Spining wheel, but they where unable to tell me anything?

Heasemans is a Bilstein dealer, but a bit hard for me to get the car to with work.

The car is on 16" wheels which i am losing soon hopefully, if that makes any difference.

Any help appreciated!!!!

Thanks in advance.

[Jeo]

I've got the same combo and yes, it's rough as hell. Moving from 17's to 15's was INCREDIBLE, 15's to 14's was marginally better.

I always just planned to replace them with a set of coilovers, but I'm guessing that doesn't really help you.

[Dweezle]

Thanks Jeo, Yourve confirmed thats its not just me..

I am happy to go with Coilovers, but would be much better if its just a mismatched spring.

I thought Bilsteins where the go to standard shock.

So thats what leans me to thinking it must just be the wrong spring.

[SIB]

Also, how old are the tyres? I recently replaced 7yr old tyres and it made a huge difference to the crashing over bumps.

[Dweezle]

The tyres came with the car on 16" wheels.

They are almost brand new ZEETEX HP101's some sort of cheap performance tyre.

Havent weighed a wheel yet, but im guessing if there heavy then that wouldnt help either.

[bensale]

I have the same setup with one difference, i also have a set of fcm progressive bump stops. The car is still stiff but acceptable. The reason your setup is so stiff is because you're essentially riding on the bump stops which means you have no suspension compliance. The fcm bump stops are shorter which gives more travel and are progressive in there hardness which means when you hit them they don't bounce back like oem. With the kings and bumpstops my car rides better than a standard clubman... Although thats not saying much... It'll always be stiff though, the bilstein shocks have way too much rebound especially at the back...

[Dweezle]

Thanks Bensale.

So really what your saying is the Bilsteins are the problem.
Sounds like there valved wrong.

Might just wait till i can get the Koni/King standard setup that most people seem to like.

Little dissapointing.
I wonder how much it would cost to get the Bilsteins revalved.
Might give heasemans a call.
I think they are the Bilstein dealers.

[bensale]

The primary problem is imo that na's don't have enough suspension travel in the rear... The secondary problem is the bilstein's valving... Personally i don't find it too bad, its a sports car after all... And the handling is awesome! I put my 14s back on the car sunday (normally nb8b 16s) and the ride quality has improved a bit.

[ak_perth]

I got my Clubman lowered recently. It had the standard Bilstein shocks on it, very very firm ride. The cars done about 135k km and the shocks were apparently in good order for their age. I was given 2 options by the company that lowered my car. First option (cheapest) King springs and special rear shock mounts from Flying Miata in the States. The rear shock mounts gives the suspension more travel at the back. Second option was coil overs (double the price of the first option when you take into account the extortionate shipping costs of the rear shock mounts from the States). I went with coil overs in the end and the ride has been transformed. It feels like a new car, so smooth and comfortable, and the car looks and handles better now its lower. Big difference to the ride, cant recommend coil overs enough. Money very well spent IMHO!

AK

[Wivvix]

To my untrained eye those shocks look like NA Bilsteins to me. If that is the case, it should come as no surprise then that the ride would be atrocious.
The NA Bilsteins were horribly valved. I've been in an NA6 with NA bilsteins on stock springs, and the ride thumped over the tiniest of imperfections in the roads. That NA6 felt like it was riding on the bumpstops too, but being that he was on stock springs I find that somewhat unlikely.

Springs generally have writing on the outside of the top half of the coil. Maybe not though, after years of wear and tear.

The questions everyone has to answer when looking at suspension is, what do I want to achieve and how much do I want to spend.

If you want it to be comfortable DD but capable on the track, then you've got a few options:
1) Koni sports ~ $750AUD landed (reuse king springs?) (+springs of choice?)
2) Tein Basic/SS/Flex ~ $1200 - $1900 landed depending on which
3) Koni Coilovers ~ $1450 landed
4) FM Vmaxx (early reviews just popping up now) ~ $1000 landed
5) BC Racing BR series ~ $1300 (locally sourced)

[Dweezle]

Thanks Wivvix -

Makes sense then.
Just thought maybe something was wrong. While looking it all up i came accross the fact that the NA bilsteins where a really stiff ride.
UGHH!!!

Good idea to reuse the Kings.

I Loved my Koni coilovers on the street, they would need a rebuild and the spring rate was never enough on the track.

Thinking seriously about getting Koni Yellows, as i never really used the height adjustment much, but love the dampener adjustability.
Just want a easy, proved street/track setup that doesnt cost 4 Grand!!

[sliq]

i think revalves would end up quite costly. i'd start looking into some superstreets

charlie brown got quoted for a revalve and a rebuild , it might be in your interest to shoot him a PM

[Charlie Brown]

I had my Tein's revalve and rebuild and it was very expensive.

You have Bilstein's so I'd be getting a model number off them and ring Heasman's (02 9557 3739) to see if the model you have can be rebuilt. Then ask for a price and compare the cost to buying new. I bet there isn't a lot of difference between the two prices, maybe 30%.

We had a Club member have his Billies revalved twice in a couple of weeks before giving up as he found them too hard and asking that they be build it to the SE spec as that was the ride he was after.

As mentioned above the best thing you can do is to get some bumpstops to suit the lowered suspension and Fat Cat Motorsports is the place to go.

[rossint]

Theres also these to increase travel at the rear: http://www.flyinmiata.com/index.php?dep ... r=13-57100 looks like they come with bump stops.
As others have stated, you need to be careful when throwing money at old shocks as you can pretty quickly get close to the price of replacements.

[Dweezle]

Thanks all for your help.

I contacted Heasemans about a rebuild.

It will cost almost $1400 to revalve, labour and alignment!!!

I basically said.. "AHHHH NO THANKYOU"!!!

I think i will definetly go with some new shocks.

If i get Koni yellows Adjustables and just reuse the King Springs it should be a pretty cheap exercise comparitivly.
Most seem really happy with that setup.

Really keen on these FM/FCM bumpstops. Makes complete sense to use these. As opposed to just cutting the standard bumpstops.