Dear brains trust: Starting problem

[Pamex]

Hello cartalk brains trust!

I'm just starting to go through the process on working this beauty out. Thought I'd post up whilst I'm 'thinking' (might take a few years) to see if anyone's got any helpful 'Oh! Check this!' type advice.

So new battery has gone in the car. I've checked all the connections and everything seems fine from the rear. (No comments). As soon as I connect up the battery, hazards come on even though I haven't pressed the hazard switch.

Go to turn her over, dash lights come on as normal, cd player spits out the trashy collection and hazards remain on. Even with pressing the hazard switch on and off, they're constantly on.

No click from the starter motor.

Yes, I've thrown the steering wheel around a bit to make sure it's not locked. I'm not that much of a nuffy.

So... what's my next port of call? I'm having an awful feeling this is an immobiliser problem (there's one in there... somewhere). I recall that former owner possibly had this problem at some point too.

Any help appreciated. I'm over catching the bus so I'll be working on this tonight for as long as it takes. :-D

[philz]

your immobiliser?

[Pamex]

Oh dear. So you reckon it's the infamous immobiliser too? Funtimes. Grasping at straws I know... but is there any checks I can do for that at all?

[wun911]

is the starter motor dead??

[meanmx]

Check your fuses just incase but I think it is the immobiliser as well

Ben

[Pamex]

Next question of the nuffy variety: How easy is it to remove the immobiliser? Is it as simple as tracing the wiring and the actual immobiliser (know nothing in the area of immobilisers and alarms remember) and removing it? I'm guessing not.

If it IS as easy as removing the actual immobiliser and wiring... the worklights are on charge and ready to go.

I would call former owner and ask him what he did... however he's just slightly over in the UK currently. :-D Not sure a 'whatever o'clock' wake-up call would be welcome.

Edit: Reading things on different forums (not mex related) it seems a lot of factory immobilisers come with a key. Does this function exist on an NA? If so, how would I go about it? Also, are there any overrides at all? Happy to take it to an auto electrician to have it seen to, would prefer to drive it there though than tow it.

[philz]

Well I know that when I remove the battery, or take off the neg terminal and put it back on the hazards flash.

But then it's back to normal.

iirc the immboliser is built into the stock ecu?

[Pamex]

The hazards keep flashing until I disconnect the battery again currently.

Phil, I'm reading that yes, it is inbuilt.

(Luckily I managed to fix my computer tonight so at least I can do some reading up on this. One thing fixed, many to go)

[Juffa]

NAs did not come with a immobiliser as standard, I don't believe that these appeared until the NB. It could be a Mazda supplied device, or a aftermarket device, but either way it is not built into the ECU.

If it is a immobiliser only, i.e. no alarm then I would be looking for a box around the size of a block of butter, probably black and most likely under the dash...and hopefully on the drivers side. It could be in the engine bay, but I'm betting under the dash. While it should have been installed so as to look factory it may still look out of place enough to be spotted. In my limited experience with car alarms there is an over-ride switch that you push at the same time as you turn the key, this allows the engine to start...but only if you have the ignition key. If you can find the small black box see if you can find a over-ride switch attached to it. Also, if you find the black box look for a name/model on it, as this might help track down the manufacturer, and support.

Good luck.
J

Just had another thought. My first 5 had a steal stopper alarm/immobiliser fitted after delivery. This was recorded in the paperwork provided to me with the car...have you checked your paperwork, it migt provide the installers details?

[Steampunk]

What Juffa said.
If you have an alarm and/or immobiliser on an NA then it's fitted either aftermarket or dealer special.
Mongoose and Cobra seem to be the two most popular brands back in the day.

[Pamex]

Juffa: No paperwork at all with mine, so can't check there (I'll drop former owner a line at some point though. We'll chat when you're not busy serving beers in London, eh STV? :-D) however I'm pretty sure said black box isn't in the engine bay. I'll have a hunt around tomorrow when it's light and see what I can find. Hopefully I'll find it and it will just be a case of de-wiring... hopefully.

Andrew: Thanks for the info. I'll have a search. Believe it or not, she's actually visiting Mongoose in Brisbane when I'm up at Christmas... to have an alarm and immobiliser fitted. *rolls eyes*

Thanks for all the info tonight everyone. Much appreciated.

I think I'm going to suddenly fall very ill on Wednesday *cough/splutter/cough* and will hunt/fix this problem then... and later when I get my starter motor from silvermx5 (thanks!) I'll put that in to avoid any non-starting issues from the main culprits for quite a while.

Need to have everything up and running in time for DECA next weekend and before I decide walking in front of the bus is preferable to catching it.

[meanmx]

As Juffa said you should be able to figure out what the immobiliser looks like under the dash. How is the immobiliser activated? Is it hooked up to central locking? Is there a switch you can flick to turn it off hidden somewhere? Ok the theory with most immobilisers is that yes you can dewire it and it is fairly straight forward except for one thing. Most often when it immobilses it does so by interrupting a circuit. This means that an important wire has been cut and the immobilser wires have been attached to both ends to allow that circuit to perform as it should when the immobilser feels that it should. Essentially look for any wires that look like they should have gone together (same colour, etc) and once you remove the immobilser wiring join these up or you still wont be able to start your car. Your a smart girl, you can figure it out. Shame I'm not out that side of town or I could help you.

[manga_blue]

Pam, I've got a StealStopper immobiliser which is a pile of crap. It's a small black box unit under the dash, above the pedals, about twice the area of a cig packet. It immobilises by intercepting the wiring from the key switch to the starter. Mine fails to operate about half the time. The unit has been swapped a couple of times but they still start to fail after a few months.

You can splice in a couple of wires and a hidden manual switch in parallel to the immobilser's starter circuit to by-pass it. This is often much easier than ripping it out because the wiring is so viral (or at least it is in mine).

If it's not the immobilser then you could have a look at your earth straps to make sure they're tightened up properly. There's one from the bodywork in the tunnel to the back of the PPF near the diff and another from the engine block below the dipstick to the little ledge below where the heater hoses go through into the cabin. If either is loose then the starter may not be able to draw enough current but everything else works OK.