Need a smoother more controlled ride

wun911 · Postby **wun911** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 12:24 pm

If he reduced the weight will he have a better more comfortable ride?

When you lower the car do you have to get softer or stiffer springs to make the ride more comfortable?

rjastra2 · Postby **rjastra2** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 12:47 pm

wun911 wrote:If he reduced the weight will he have a better more comfortable ride?

When you lower the car do you have to get softer or stiffer springs to make the ride more comfortable?

Increased car weight usually results in a smoother ride

Though reducing unsprung weight will usually improve ride (wheels, tyres, suspension bits)

stevesports · Postby **stevesports** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 12:53 pm

uncertain. A change in weight changes the tuning requirements for spring/damper rates. As always, you should try to tune your spring and damper rates to match. That is, you tune the spring rates to suit the weight of the car and the ride height, and then tune the damper rates to suit the spring rates. For a controlled ride, the ideal frequency should be around 1 Hertz, which means that the downward and upward movement should be complete within 1 second.

also ben, structural rigidity is very important because o/w, your car would act as the dampener. Ideally your suspension should be the only components that act to dampen the car. In order words, your car's chassis should remain fixed regardless of road conditions, and your suspension should be the only components moving up and down. If your chassis is flexing, you could feel it through your seat. For example, i dunno about your car but at higher speed when encountering fast bumps, i can feel my car flexing so the chassis vibrates, which causes the rough ride. This i believe can be fixed via 2 methods.

1. Shocks that are tuned to the ride height and suspension travel
2. Increased chassis rigidity.

Garry · Postby **Garry** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 1:05 pm

Just for the record, you dont need to go to the Bilstein brand to get your dampers set up how you want them. Koni's, amongst other brands, can also be revalved to your specs. I have had a set of Koni's revalved in the past. As Mactype pointed out though, it doesn't come cheap.

mhj · Postby **mhj** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 6:53 pm

fm butterfly brace does a good thing to the chassis...but if it's too expensive you could buy second hand presseed steel factory brace from 2002 nb. doesnt do the rails but would be cheaper to buy , if not to fit. no idea if it fits an na

i know mx5 mania has them

mhj

Fatty · Postby **Fatty** » Mon Jun 30, 2008 7:44 pm

ben.... i have a set of used clubman bilsteins that i have been trying to flog off for ages. no luck so far.

it might be a good idea to ring the bilstein dealer here in vic (i had their details somewhere.... ) and talk to them about how much it would cost to get these shocks rebuilt / revalved. it may / may not turn out to be a good option for you, depending on their answer.

then you can make me an offer (a carton of beer would be a good start :lol:

)

ampz · Postby **ampz** » Wed Jul 02, 2008 12:45 pm

Ben sorry for the late reply...

I was at Heasmans on monday getting a wheel alignment (first one since i bought the car of Matty) :oops:

Anyways, I got quoted $220 a pair for revalving and matching to my specs (including measuring the current lowered Racing Beat springs and matching them)....

This would be for the Bilstein setup and the shocks out of the car, springs disassembled etc. For them to pull it out of the car labour charges would be above the quote...

Currently the RB springs sit on KYB AGX shocks and felt quite underdamped with the shocks on the softest setting, before the wheel alignment I added a lower rear brace and the handling had changed quite a bit (a lot less bum wiggle over bumps)...

Now the shocks are 1/2 way to firm and the car feels quite a bit better, it does still crash over lager bumps but is not as nervous over slight bumps.

I will be in Melbourne mid next month and we can meet up if you wish for a test drive...

Mine is on the left... (Mr Q made sure i gave him his keys back :cry:

)

rjastra2 · Postby **rjastra2** » Wed Jul 02, 2008 3:02 pm

ampz wrote:Ben sorry for the late reply...

I was at Heasmans on monday getting a wheel alignment (first one since i bought the car of Matty)

Anyways, I got quoted $220 a pair for revalving and matching to my specs (including measuring the current lowered Racing Beat springs and matching them)....

This would be for the Bilstein setup and the shocks out of the car, springs disassembled etc. For them to pull it out of the car labour charges would be above the quote...

Would that be for digressive valved Bilsteins? digressive valving is the way to go for a decent ride with short stiff springs.

meanmx · Postby **meanmx** » Wed Jul 02, 2008 5:09 pm

Thanks everyone for the replies, it has been an interesting decision to make. From what I can gather body bracing isn't the be all and end all in what I am after although it is important regarding body stiffness and letting the suspension do it's thing. So that will be added soon although unsure if I will go the Racing Beat type or the cheaper Mania type. Also what I have gathered is that having rebound and compression adjustable is preferable as well as having matched springs. To this end I am leaning towards the flyin miata kits that they have with the Tokico shocks. Although I would be looking at the adjustable spring platforms as I want it a fair bit lower. Still need to do a bit more research as I would like the rear shocks to adjust from the bottom as I have a sub in the way and the later model tokico shocks do this. If you want to see what I am talking about then click the link

http://www.flyinmiata.com/index.php?dept=12

Ben

Mr_Q · Postby **Mr_Q** » Wed Jul 02, 2008 6:06 pm

Just to make things more difficult ...

My Clubman had all the standard NA8 bracing and decent shocks/springs. It was much improved on my old NA6 (which in turn had been improved by added bracing/shocks). However, neither of them are anywhere near as comfortable as the SE.

ampz · Postby **ampz** » Wed Jul 02, 2008 7:09 pm

rjastra2 wrote:Would that be for digressive valved Bilsteins? digressive valving is the way to go for a decent ride with short stiff springs.

That would be to match the shocks to the springs, they mentioned the valving would be changed/adjusted to suit.

I have not heard of digressive valving, but if that's one way to do it i guess so.

Matty · Postby **Matty** » Thu Jul 03, 2008 11:39 am

nearly all shocks are digressive valved.

rjastra2 · Postby **rjastra2** » Thu Jul 03, 2008 1:01 pm

Matty wrote:nearly all shocks are digressive valved.

I am not so sure of that.. It's a fairly recent trend and usually only on high end shock absorbers.

wun911 · Postby **wun911** » Fri Jul 04, 2008 11:02 am

Are the springs used in the coil overs progressive?

If its not progressive maybe he can just cut the sping...

Matty · Postby **Matty** » Fri Jul 04, 2008 11:42 am

rjastra2 wrote:
Matty wrote:nearly all shocks are digressive valved.

I am not so sure of that.. It's a fairly recent trend and usually only on high end shock absorbers.

crap. All (OEM) MX-5 shocks are digressive.