need help/ideas, new engine no starty :(

Sheck · Postby **Sheck** » Sat Sep 15, 2007 7:10 pm

Hey guys, just finished my engine transplant (not a fun or quick job!!!! especially by yourself) and after sorting out some cam issues (i had them the wrong way around) and getting some compression numbers (not good but good enough for it to start, blaming sticky valves and will re-test after a few hundred kms) i decided to warm her up.
No go.

I checked the spark wires, had them the wrong way around, fixed, no fire. Checked all the electronics where connected, yep even disconnected and reconnected them, no go. Checked the sprak plugs were actually sparking, yep nice shock to prove it too. It's definately getting fuel cause it got flooded after all the turning. So i waited a while for it to evaporate and even disconnected one of the injectors, not good. Dissconnected a different injector, no good.
I called my tuner and asked if the eManage can lose its memory if the battery is disconnected, he said no.

So i'm left with no ideas, can anyone help with some ideas please?

Thanks everyone!
Dave

fattima · Postby **fattima** » Sat Sep 15, 2007 7:22 pm

If you have been mucking about with cams are you sure your timing is OK? May want to put the engine on TDC (don't go by the marks on pulley) and make sure your cam and ignition timing is OK.

Sheck · Postby **Sheck** » Sat Sep 15, 2007 7:56 pm

Yea pretty sure the cams are spot on, also every time i play with the cams the ignition timing goes a little off so i had that loose and tried it at many different positions while trying to start it. (didnt turn the CAS while cranking tho, just inbetween attempts).

Just to make sure, i was taking the TDC mark (on the harmonic balencer) as being the little notch in the pulley and i lined it up with the ) deg timing mark. Is that right? Or should it of been on the indicator thingy on the left side of the cover?

Cheers

NMX516 · Postby **NMX516** » Sat Sep 15, 2007 7:57 pm

Could well be the crank angle sensor. Have you re-installed that correctly, and then plugged it back in?? That would be my first guess...

Sheck · Postby **Sheck** » Sat Sep 15, 2007 8:00 pm

yep, it only fits one way, and yea tried it in different amount of timing advance/retard and still no go.

sprx3 · Postby **sprx3** » Sat Sep 15, 2007 8:03 pm

Sheck wrote:Yea pretty sure the cams are spot on, also every time i play with the cams the ignition timing goes a little off so i had that loose and tried it at many different positions while trying to start it. (didnt turn the CAS while cranking tho, just inbetween attempts).

Just to make sure, i was taking the TDC mark (on the harmonic balencer) as being the little notch in the pulley and i lined it up with the ) deg timing mark. Is that right? Or should it of been on the indicator thingy on the left side of the cover?

Cheers

ok speaking from an nb point of view, i may have found your problem, by notch do you mean an indentation in the pulley or a thing that sticks out> if your going by the indentation all good, if your going buy the little thing that sticks out thats wrong... your timing could be very far off if its flooding but your getting no firing...

can you take the emb off & see if it starts with it off?

can you data log trying to start it?

Sheck · Postby **Sheck** » Sat Sep 15, 2007 9:10 pm

dont think it has a thing that sticks out, but yea i was talking about the indentation the one used to gauge timing advance once the car is running.

Cant take the emb off because i'm running bigger injectors - stock computer would flood the engine, which is why i rang my tuner and asked about the map wipe with battery disconected concern, but from what he says it should be all good..

I was thinking about swapping injectors for the smaller original set but i'm not sure if they have siezed by now. That way i'll know for sure if the emb has been wiped (thou i think they have a flash memory??)

Thanks guys keep em comming!!!

zoomzoom · Postby **zoomzoom** » Sat Sep 15, 2007 9:22 pm

If I remember correctly...

The timing mark on the pulley should be lined up with the \"T\" degree mark on the fron cover when setting up the timing, and the \"E\" on the INLET cam wheel lines up with the \"E\" o the backing plate and the \"I\" on the EXHAUST cam wheel with the \"I\" on the plate behind.

Tim

zoomzoom · Postby **zoomzoom** » Sat Sep 15, 2007 9:24 pm

PS This should put the I on the inlet cam at 12 o'clock and likewise for the E on the exhaust

Sheck · Postby **Sheck** » Sat Sep 15, 2007 9:31 pm

yep thats what i set it up as thanks.
The reason i had it wrong before is due to aftermarket cam gears having three slots for the numb thingy at the end of the cam to go into. Got that sorted when i found no compression on any of the pistons.

Cheers

sabretooth · Postby **sabretooth** » Sat Sep 15, 2007 10:42 pm

NMX516 wrote:Could well be the crank angle sensor. Have you re-installed that correctly, and then plugged it back in?? That would be my first guess...

Just so you know - you'll get either no spark or no fuel events if the CAS is bung.

Sheck, have you tried a compression test?

edit: I re-read your first post, and saw and getting some compression numbers - how did you do this test, out of interest? Did you unplug the harness from the coil packs, or did you have the leads and coils still plugged in but with no spark plugs connected?

Sheck · Postby **Sheck** » Sun Sep 16, 2007 9:16 am

I had the harness unplugged, which to my knowledge ment no fuel or spark.
Also i've re-used the cas from my old motor as the new one was crushed a bit.

Dave

sabretooth · Postby **sabretooth** » Sun Sep 16, 2007 12:25 pm

Assuming by harness you meant the CAS harness, then yeah, you're right.

Can you verify that you still compression now? How good is the spark you're getting?

Sheck · Postby **Sheck** » Sun Sep 16, 2007 3:23 pm

Thanks to everyone for the replys. I've finnaly got it up and running.
Dad said this morning that we probably got the cams in the wrong orientation. So after a bit of M.net garage searching i went back to the car and took the cam cover off as well as the cam gears.
They were wrong, so i set them up properly and she fired up first go!! yey

But wait theres water leaking from somewhere, oh no its the intake manifold. Off that came and on with some exhaust gasket sealant and she's all good. I set the timing then cleaned up the garage, and took a shower. Now i'll take her for a drive to make sure every thing is definalety shweet.

Oh i re-did the compression test after re aligning the cams and they went up a little. now i have:
1: 145
2: 145
3: 190
4: 190

Not very even between those two sets, but this engine had been sitting around for a good long time - probably 1.5 yrs and when i started the car i had some very loud tappet noise which has gone away now so i'll re-check the comp in a couple of weeks to see if the first two have caught up any.

Thanks again to everyone who helped!!!!
Dave