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hey guys ive put a budget of 4k to put the turbo kit together for my car, im after what people would spend the money on if it was theirs...

Hey guys ive done some research so im also putting in links for future reference for me & others.

im thinking
gt28r $1025 www.vpw.com.au
cast exhaust manifold $450 http://www.smb.net.au/mx5zone.htm
dump pipe ?
will make my own exhaust & cooler pipes
water to air ( pwr barrel) intercooler (if i can budget it in) $1100 vpw
emanage ?
fuel pressure reg
all the water oil & other lines
bov
larger injectors?
fuel pump?


what am i forgeting? where would you source the parts from? what would you buy new & second hand?

any info would be great guys, im handy & can fit it all & make things work as well as weld & stuff so i wont need to pay anyone for labour ;)

i don't think a rx7 afm swap works on a 1.8 ? ?

1.8's use a maf , not afm . right ?

air to air intercooler should do the job fine, be cheaper and easier too.

instead of emanage and fuel pressure reg , have a think about bigger injectors and megasquirt. should be around the same price, if not a bit cheaper, and does the job better. this depends on what 1.8 you are talking about tho - which do you have ? na8, nb8a, b, or c ?

you should come in under $4000 easilly, seeing as you can do a lot of the fab work yourself.

and yeah go second hand where you can (turbo, mani, injectors).

hey fatty, its a 98 model, so to be honnest i dont even know i thought they started from nb8a will need to go look at the vin im guessing?

i also dont want to use a stand alone comp, would rather a piggy back, but in saying that could you tell me some advantages of the megasquirt over the emanage

also what turbo's if going second hand would be good options?

looking for around 150kw with around 200 as an option with upgrades

You have an NB8A so you won't need to do the afm swap. I think that your budget is very reasonable and will allow you some headroom for very nice gear. You will need a recirculating BOV if you're thinking 150-200kw.

Looks like you are on the right track. Check out Bell Engineering for cast manifold and decent dump pipe, and you'll be able to source injectors from the US forum I told you about - www.miataturbo.net .

You might need a bigger fuel pump to run the numbers you are looking for, instead of the fuel pressure reg.

Boags

98 would be a nb8a i think.

if you wanna stick with a piggyback the emanage seems like a good choice.

benefits of megasquirt...um, well you can ditch the afm/maf and just use a map sensor, and also i think they can be tuned more effectively as it is a standalone / parallel install. it also has launch control, traction control, boost control (altho that is still experimental at this stage i think) . a piggyback is fine tho, probly easier, but really you are only \"tricking\" the stock ecu so i don't think you can tune them as well as you can tune a standalone.

what turbo to use if going second hand, well it depends what you can find but i reckon pretty much the same as if you are buying new. you can always find second hand turbos. seems a lot of nissan guys etc will upgrade their turbos to bigger units, and sell their old turbo . these units are usually heaps big enough for our smaller engines, and can be had cheap.

you should be able to get to 140 / 150 kw pretty easilly. 200kw is a bit harder to get to, as you might need to spend a lot of money on stronger engine internals to get to that level of power.

If you are going aftermarket computer then look at Haltech E8 lotsa goodies in that one.

I've also heard of some people having troubles with running aftermarket computers due to what the factory unit sorts out in the later NB's, might be better off with a piggyback.

The Pupat wrote:If you are going aftermarket computer then look at Haltech E8 lotsa goodies in that one.

I've also heard of some people having troubles with running aftermarket computers due to what the factory unit sorts out in the later NB's, might be better off with a piggyback.

yeh thats the reason i want to stick with the piggy back, as the computer controls the chip in the key & soforth. plus i dont want the hassle of epa & all that crap. I want a car that i can drive everyday & have lots of fun with

Ive read that a few of the guys are using 1800 (NB) injectors, are there different rated injectors or are they all the same through out the range?

thanks again guys
Zoran

sprx3 wrote:hey guys ive put a budget of 4k to put the turbo kit together for my car, im after what people would spend the money on if it was theirs...

im thinking
gt28r
cast exhaust manifold
dump pipe
will make my own exhaust & cooler pipes
water to air ( pwr barrel) intercooler (if i can budget it in)
emanage
fuel pressure reg
all the water oil & other lines
afm rx7 conversion

what am i forgeting? where would you source the parts from? what would you buy new & second hand?

T28's can be found in any sort of condition
cast manifold - AVO
forget the water to air intercooler in an MX-5 air to air is much more efficent considering the space and parts a water to air on takes up
emanage? - get a proper pigy back computer that will take care of everything
fuel presure reg - most speed shops sell them

for what its worth - I can see why everyone wants to do 'budget turbo installs'
But in 3 to 4 years time when you've done say 150 thou on the budget turbo installation will it be in the same condition?

if you buy a second hand turbo of a say S14/S15 your looking at at most a 10yo turbo that would have done prob 100 to 150 thou

The other part of the budget installation is the degree of how the parts fit together!

If you buy a turbo that was to fit a 13/14/15 nissan the outlets are bolt style so you have to have pipes that bolt onto the turbo factory style
Not a big deal but when you can buy a turbo from garrett specifically designed to suit the 1.6 and have the outlets etc pointing in all the right directions and on top of that have a warranty is it worth it?

you can make your own pipes and exhaust thats a major bonus but if you save here why not spend more in the area's where needed? ie parts that need to be reliable like the turbo and manifold

forget all the crap on ebay most of it is junk
the stainless high rise manifolds after prolonged heat cycles will start to crack due to the weight of the turbo housing/dump pipe exerting down force on them

for arguments sake do any car manufacturers make turbo housings with a turbo mounted so high and far out from the block with stainless?

The cast highrise manifold that sabretooth has on his car would be worth a look at fitting if you are after the high rise style as it is cast

even all the dump pipes that are on ebay for get them as uncle arthur will tell you they arn't worth a pinch of shi7!

At the end of the day you want something that you can rely on day in day out no matter what psi or kw you want to run

if you skimp on parts now or opt for the cheaper option now you will only have to upgrade further down the track to replace the bits that were old and now are older or the bits that were at the time 'the ducks nuts' but are now not so.

I'm not knocking all the people that have done it to a budget infact I aplaude that it is what they set out to achieve and they have done so.

In the years to come I guess there is going to be an influx in people turboing mx-5's due to the low cost of a base car then spending dollars on top of it will result in a nice turbo car for little out lay
How we go about doing them is what will save you the money long term

if you are going to spend 4 why not go the whole AVO kit minus intercooler and exhaust?
I'm sure it would come in close to that budget, I would be suprised if it wasn't close
and just use a hybrid style intercooler?

factor in a few tow truck rides (just in case), dyno time and engineering into your cost as well

sprx3 wrote:

The Pupat wrote:If you are going aftermarket computer then look at Haltech E8 lotsa goodies in that one.

I've also heard of some people having troubles with running aftermarket computers due to what the factory unit sorts out in the later NB's, might be better off with a piggyback.

yeh thats the reason i want to stick with the piggy back, as the computer controls the chip in the key & soforth. plus i dont want the hassle of epa & all that crap. I want a car that i can drive everyday & have lots of fun with

Ive read that a few of the guys are using 1800 (NB) injectors, are there different rated injectors or are they all the same through out the range?

thanks again guys
Zoran

1.8 injectors are bigger than 1.6
so a turbo 1.6 on minimal boost will work on 1.8's
if you turbo the 1.8 then you will need bigger ijectors as well
factor in 200 or so for these depending on how old and where you get them
i found mine on the for laser forums
for 150 then spent 50 bucks on them cleaning them up getting the flow tested etc
worth itt when your pushing your engine harder than it has ever gone before!

sprx3 wrote:

The Pupat wrote:If you are going aftermarket computer then look at Haltech E8 lotsa goodies in that one.

I've also heard of some people having troubles with running aftermarket computers due to what the factory unit sorts out in the later NB's, might be better off with a piggyback.

yeh thats the reason i want to stick with the piggy back, as the computer controls the chip in the key & soforth. plus i dont want the hassle of epa & all that crap. I want a car that i can drive everyday & have lots of fun with

Ive read that a few of the guys are using 1800 (NB) injectors, are there different rated injectors or are they all the same through out the range?

thanks again guys
Zoran

btw most aftermarket ecu's can be run in conjunction with your factor computer so that everything else still runs as per normal

my microtech still works along side the factory ecu
hence it is pretty much working piggy back
wether its a full stand alone or piggy back there is plenty of market choice when it comes to the products you can use and most products used in the field are and would have been used by people on this forum.

don't just go for the cheapest easiest option!

I'm with LM here - definitely Definitely DEFINITELY do some homework.

Boags and I both just did budget setups - both under $4k, BUT IT HELPS WHEN YOU HAVE CAPABLE FRIENDS WHO CAN HELP.

You don't always get what you pay for - I bought my kit as a bitsa from another forumite - good price, and good (looking) bits, some of which are readily available from EBay sellers, but there have been some teething problems.

SS tube manifold required additional relief cuts to the mounting plate to fit the manifold bolts. No biggie, but annoying for 'bolt on'.

the 'bolt on' SS dump pipe required some substantial modification JUST to get it to fit into the engine bay without having a hoist, and even then it needed additional cutting and rewelding to give enough clearance to the gearbox housing to enable us to build and fit it up to an exhaust.

I can't begin to describe how hard it was to attach the dumppipe bottom stud/nut, which actually sits right beneath the lower curve of the dunp pipe - I had to cut a high tensile nut in half, then ease it into place with my fingers while holding the dumppipe off the stud to make enough room, then do it up with an open end spanner, BY FEEL - no line of sight, 1/8 of a turn at a time. To add insult to injury, the A/C needed to be removed temporarily and a new pipe has to be made up because the dumppipe design made no provision for the AC line running along the passenger side chassis rail, and the heater hose coming off the side of the block needed to be bent into a new shape because the O2 sensor location on the dump pipe pointed straight at and into the hose - no room for either.....

Additional bracing needed to be made (easy enough - just some flat bar) to go from the top of the turbo to the block to avoid the heat cycle/weight/cracking issue LM mentioned.

Injectors needed servicing (look up MAZBIZ on the Ausrotary forum), and the turbo needed to be rebuilt after a workshop I took it to for minor work dropped it, and failed to tell me - the weight of the cast iron turbine housing on landing cracked the oil bearing backing plate, and smashed the compressor wheel into the housing, bending all the fins. Again - knowing someone saved me in the order of $700-$800 on that job.

LM here built my SS exhaust, and also did all my SS intake and IC pipework - jobs which could have cost me into the $thousands at commercial/workshop rates.

Yes - a less than smooth road, but not too bumpy. That said - I took my time with things, and I'm ultimately happy with the result. It's all about what you're prepared to do, what you can pay for, and what you can do yourself.

hey lowmiata, thanks for your input, from what i understand emanage is a pretty good management controller, could you please tell me why you wouldnt use it?

as for turbo i think i'll be going new, ive just had a gt28r quoted from vpw & i can get it for just over 1k so as you said not worth the effort in even looking for a 2nd hand one & wondering if it will be safe.

Ive tried calling avo & they will be returning my call regarding the kits they have so thats still an option.

What injectors would you recommend for the power in looking at without maxing out duty cycles?

what else is there to know?

GET AN EMANAGE!!!!!

THEY WORK EVEN BETTER ON A NB 1800 THAN THE NA 1600'S

Get an emanage, some 330cc or 365 cc injectors and your set..NO FPR's or bigger fuel pumps required.
you need the following for an emanage....
Emanage blue
Ignition harness
\"support tool\" for laptop tuning(includes USB cable)
MAP(boost) sensor...use a GM 2 bar sensor or motorola 2.5 bar sensor.
Oxygen sensor clamp(stops it running lean below 4000rpm.)
this will come to less than the toher options mentioned and will integrate much better in terms of drivability and fuel economy.(and you can keep your factory knock sensor)

A fellow club member is coming around next week to set up his HKS turbo powered Nb, he has some 330cc injectors to put in too, so will keep you updated on progress.

hey guys i spoke to avo today & they have quoted me 4800 for the complete kit without installation. im hoping to have a few trick parts with the 4k if i play my cards right so unless they drop to around 4k its a no no for now.

avo also wanted 800 for the cast manifold as did mx5 mania.

ive read in another post that sp motorsport & hks do a cast manifold for around the 400 mark?

does anyone know where to buy these & if there are links to sites i can see & read up on these pieces?

also are these in aus of o.s?


help me

4sfed5 wrote:GET AN EMANAGE!!!!!

THEY WORK EVEN BETTER ON A NB 1800 THAN THE NA 1600'S

Get an emanage, some 330cc or 365 cc injectors and your set..NO FPR's or bigger fuel pumps required.
you need the following for an emanage....
Emanage blue
Ignition harness
"support tool" for laptop tuning(includes USB cable)
MAP(boost) sensor...use a GM 2 bar sensor or motorola 2.5 bar sensor.
Oxygen sensor clamp(stops it running lean below 4000rpm.)
this will come to less than the toher options mentioned and will integrate much better in terms of drivability and fuel economy.(and you can keep your factory knock sensor)

A fellow club member is coming around next week to set up his HKS turbo powered Nb, he has some 330cc injectors to put in too, so will keep you updated on progress.

thanks for that 4sfed5
could you give me a little info on the hks kit & if it is still available in n.z as they seem to be discontinued in aus as far as the hks website shows, also if anyone knows of any in aus on the shelf id be interested in it.

ok gm 2 bar sensors are easy as they come off commy's & camira's here so that will be a cheapy, what comes with the emanage & what will i need to buy that is not included in it, i think you pretty much summed it up but do no bits come with the emanage blue? also have you played with the auto tune?

cant wait to here how this car comes up.

oh does anyone know what nb injectors flow at?